Down goes the keel.....

A forum for discussing topics relating to older MacGregor/Venture sailboats.

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old guys sail
Deckhand
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:30 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26S
Location: Spartanburg, SC

Down goes the keel.....

Post by old guys sail » Sun Mar 21, 2010 3:33 pm

I got my 1980 Mac 22 over a year ago, have been working for this past Sat, checking everything out. (unfortunately hoped the keel was okay).
We put in at Lake Murray, SC. yesterday. Beautiful day, and it sailed great. We lowered the keel as we raised the sails. Somewhere out in the middle a couple large boats went by, causing the Mac to rock lot--and we heard a loud bang from the Keel. I told my sone to make sure we werent taking on water. We were okay and sailed for a couple more hours. When we turned arond were had a nice little breeze all the way back to the dam from the starboard port quarter. I noticed we kept "sliding" with the wind. I kept checking the cable on the keel. We finally figured that it somehow was up and would go down. After we got the boat on the trailer, I crawled underneath, and NO KEEL.
The pivot pin is still in place. The chain broke. I guess the keel broke in pieces at the pin.
So now, did I just enjoy my first and last day of sailing with my boat? If not, what are my options?

Lloyd Franks
First Officer
Posts: 208
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2005 7:10 pm
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, Fl

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by Lloyd Franks » Sun Mar 21, 2010 6:24 pm

Man, that is a bummer. My V224 keel weight is 575 pounds, so yours must be of similar weight. I assume it is not salvageable from the lake (unless you're good at scuba diving), so your only choice is to replace it. No small task, given its weight. Maybe others can comment on the possibility of replacing the keel with something made of lighter material, and then adding ballast to the boat for compensation. Airing your problem here is a good first step, and I'm sure there is an answer. Good luck!

billstevens_1999
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Feb 27, 2010 9:10 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 25

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by billstevens_1999 » Sun Mar 21, 2010 6:59 pm

Google "Don's Marine, Clearwater Fl". You may need to call them and ask for Bill. They had a Magregor keel for sale and they will negoitate price. I think it was for a 25 though. I have a keel for a SouthCoast. Sometime this spring if it gets here, I will be going to Marion, SC pulling a trailer with a car on it. Perhaps 500 lb additional weight would not make a big difference in the pull. Let me know?

Jamie79
Chief Steward
Posts: 63
Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2010 6:39 pm
Sailboat: Venture 23
Location: Gaston, S.C.

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by Jamie79 » Sun Mar 21, 2010 7:59 pm

Im in gaston sc, not too far from murray, i would be willing to give you a hand when your parts come in if your close by 575lbs is kinda heavy if you need a hand let me know.

old guys sail
Deckhand
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:30 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26S
Location: Spartanburg, SC

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by old guys sail » Sun Mar 21, 2010 8:16 pm

Thanks Guys. Bill, I will google. Will let you know. Jamie--thanks for your offer. Its gonna be a wrestle, isnt it. Will also let you know.

Lloyd Franks
First Officer
Posts: 208
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2005 7:10 pm
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, Fl

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by Lloyd Franks » Mon Mar 22, 2010 6:52 pm

As this saga develops, please keep the board apprised. Looks like there are some solutions.

old guys sail
Deckhand
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:30 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26S
Location: Spartanburg, SC

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by old guys sail » Mon Mar 22, 2010 7:39 pm

Okay Lloyd. Will keep you apprised. I did not think of "Fix It and Sail" I have that book. Will look at it this weekend. My brother in law, who lives next door, could fabricate that--if I wanted to be that much in his debt, if you know what I mean. Also have seen Mac 22's on ebay auctioning for from $300 to $1200. So will keep you apprised.

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ChockFullOnuts22
First Officer
Posts: 215
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 1:17 pm
Sailboat: Venture 2-22

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by ChockFullOnuts22 » Tue Mar 23, 2010 11:55 am

Replacement keels are not available from MacGregor or aftermarket at this time. I've looked. Even used ones are hard to find, especially separate from the rest of the boat that it originally came with.

Your best bet is to find a donor boat. I hate to even say that, but keels for the 22's are hard to come by. They have a whole different shape to them than the other boats do. Not only would a keel from a 25 be too heavy, but it would likely be too wide to fit into the trunk (based on what I've seen of the Mac 25's up close). Mac 25 keels appear to have a wider bulb in the foil at the bottom of the keel.

Unfortunately, this is the drawback of cast iron keels....rust and stress over time weaken them quickly around the pivot hole.

Steel is said to be stronger than cast iron (higher tensile strength), but the steel types on the early boats had the problem with the fiberglass covering delaminating.

Bob McLellan
Engineer
Posts: 128
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:11 pm
Sailboat: Venture 2-22
Location: Mesa, Arizona

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by Bob McLellan » Tue Mar 23, 2010 3:16 pm

I would study the Brian Gilbert book and construct a new keel from sheet metal. It could even be of more sheets of a thinner steel and thus would take a little less filler for foil shaping, if done correctly. As far as the de-laminating fiberglass problem, look how long the original lasted - you are looking at many years of service.

I was looking for a keel for a Venture 24 when I found a 1976 Venture 25 for less than a keel for the 24; and it came complete - even with a 9.9 hp Honda.

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ChockFullOnuts22
First Officer
Posts: 215
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 1:17 pm
Sailboat: Venture 2-22

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by ChockFullOnuts22 » Tue Mar 23, 2010 9:00 pm

Bob McLellan wrote:I would study the Brian Gilbert book and construct a new keel from sheet metal. It could even be of more sheets of a thinner steel and thus would take a little less filler for foil shaping, if done correctly. As far as the de-laminating fiberglass problem, look how long the original lasted - you are looking at many years of service.

I was looking for a keel for a Venture 24 when I found a 1976 Venture 25 for less than a keel for the 24; and it came complete - even with a 9.9 hp Honda.
The Brian Gilbert book doesn't give all of the needed dimensions, though. He's missing measurements for the hole centers, angles, and the keel thickness he gives isn't representative of the top of the keel. I'm not sure if MacGregor Yacht Corp still has all of that info on file or not, but that's where you'd really want to go for that information.

That's a good idea about layering thinner plates to form more of the foil without need for so much filler, though. :D

THE CUSCUS
First Officer
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:59 am
Sailboat: Venture 25
Location: North East River, MD

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by THE CUSCUS » Wed Mar 24, 2010 8:33 am

Old Guys Sail
I have blueprint drawings for the 22' keels (post '73 cast, and the earlier plate/fiberglass type). Private message me and I will e-mail them to you.

rgranger
Deckhand
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2010 12:31 pm
Sailboat: Venture 2-24

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by rgranger » Wed Mar 24, 2010 1:21 pm

Image

A few months back I got a burr up my (you know what) and sketched a design for a new Keel for my V222.

Here is an image.

And I can mail you a *.doc if you would like more details in the construction.

Rob

Bob McLellan
Engineer
Posts: 128
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:11 pm
Sailboat: Venture 2-22
Location: Mesa, Arizona

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by Bob McLellan » Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:22 pm

I don't remember where I got these:

Image

Image

Image

old guys sail
Deckhand
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:30 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26S
Location: Spartanburg, SC

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by old guys sail » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:39 am

Wow Bob--those look great!! Those are probably what I am trying to get from MacGregor!!. Hope they are the right ones for my boat. Thanks a million!!

old guys sail
Deckhand
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:30 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26S
Location: Spartanburg, SC

Re: Down goes the keel.....

Post by old guys sail » Mon Mar 29, 2010 7:43 am

I got the guy at MacGregor to send me a sketch of the keel. My father in law and brother in law are going to take a shot at building. My father in laws idea was to take some scrap 1/4" steel he has, cut into four pieces and weld it into sort of a stretched diamond shape. Then, depending on the weight, adding steel shot if need be. Or, he said for a little more cost he has a friend that could bend two pieces into shape so there would be no weld on the sides. They also have the means to lift the boat with no problem. This is great!!

As mentioned above in another post, I dont know with this shape if I will need to coat it. Think thats absolutely necessary?

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