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Leading Halyards Aft

A forum for discussing topics relating to older MacGregor/Venture sailboats.

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Leading Halyards Aft

Postby AlaskaMC » Fri Aug 09, 2013 12:44 am

One of our first projects on our 25 will be to make the boat easily singlehanded. Our thoughts are to add a DIY curler, a traveler at the companionway, and to bring the halyards back to the cockpit. One this final one I was hoping to see what folks have done as far as line handling. I am thinking a block on the mast base, then at the front of the house, then one or two fairleads to a double line clutch on one side and single on the other (port-main halyard and reef, starboard-jib halyard).

Does this seem like a good plan? Any pics of other folks solutions?
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby Tomfoolery » Fri Aug 09, 2013 7:38 am

The plan as outlined sounds typical, but unless you have to get around something, you don't need the fairleads in front of the clutches. They have a SS flared opening, and will do their own fairleading (is that a word? :D ). Edit: If you aim the clutches at the deck organizers correctly, there won't even be a need for a fairlead - the lines should go straight in.

Deck organizers are normally used to turn around a vertical axis, like where the lines bend approximately 90 degrees (can by anything - doesn't have to be 90) from the mast base to the rope clutches. Keeps things neater than individual blocks.

The only thing I have lead aft is the main halyard, which was originally cleated at the mast. Main sheet is at the helm anyway, and the roller furler is also led aft, but they always are. If I need to reef, I do it before taking off.

I think every boat I've owned had the main halyard on the starboard side and the jib on the port, but I don't know if that's custom or coincidence.
Last edited by Tomfoolery on Fri Aug 09, 2013 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby dlandersson » Fri Aug 09, 2013 8:54 am

Here's my solution. :P

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZAwqDpWYaI

AlaskaMC wrote:One of our first projects on our 25 will be to make the boat easily singlehanded. Our thoughts are to add a DIY curler, a traveler at the companionway, and to bring the halyards back to the cockpit. One this final one I was hoping to see what folks have done as far as line handling. I am thinking a block on the mast base, then at the front of the house, then one or two fairleads to a double line clutch on one side and single on the other (port-main halyard and reef, starboard-jib halyard).

Does this seem like a good plan? Any pics of other folks solutions?
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby Tomfoolery » Fri Aug 09, 2013 8:58 am

It's backwards - the bimbo seats are for the guests. You know, so the other sailors and club members can see them more clearly. :wink:
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby dlandersson » Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:26 am

But...but...but...she steers the boat so well! :P

tkanzler wrote:It's backwards - the bimbo seats are for the guests. You know, so the other sailors and club members can see them more clearly. :wink:
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby RobertB » Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:25 am

tkanzler wrote:It's backwards - the bimbo seats are for the guests. You know, so the other sailors and club members can see them more clearly. :wink:


Time are a changing - maybe he is her bimbo :D
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby Tomfoolery » Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:49 am

RobertB wrote:
tkanzler wrote:It's backwards - the bimbo seats are for the guests. You know, so the other sailors and club members can see them more clearly. :wink:
Times are a changing - maybe he is her bimbo :D

He's a mimbo.

(a la Jerry Seinfeld)
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby Freedom77 » Fri Aug 09, 2013 12:10 pm

I got a copy of SAILPOWER by Wallace Ross. It is my rigging guide. Lots of good info on other subjects. Don't no if it is still in print. As I mentioned keep your checkbook open. A boat is a hole in the water into which you pour endless amounts of money. If you can't go sailing you can read about sailing
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby AlaskaMC » Fri Aug 09, 2013 1:57 pm

tkanzler wrote:The plan as outlined sounds typical, but unless you have to get around something, you don't need the fairleads in front of the clutches. They have a SS flared opening, and will do their own fairleading (is that a word? :D ). Edit: If you aim the clutches at the deck organizers correctly, there won't even be a need for a fairlead - the lines should go straight in.

Deck organizers are normally used to turn around a vertical axis, like where the lines bend approximately 90 degrees (can by anything - doesn't have to be 90) from the mast base to the rope clutches. Keeps things neater than individual blocks.

The only thing I have lead aft is the main halyard, which was originally cleated at the mast. Main sheet is at the helm anyway, and the roller furler is also led aft, but they always are. If I need to reef, I do it before taking off.

I think every boat I've owned had the main halyard on the starboard side and the jib on the port, but I don't know if that's custom or coincidence.


Thanks! I think changing from the extra block to an organizer will be best as you suggest. I am planning on bringing the reefing back as I am trying to make this boat match closely another boat we regularly take out in Seward.

On the halyards being port or starboard, I have seen both in looking at many boats over the last few years. One consistency is that the fore sail controls are usually together on one side and the main on the other. For example, one we have been on a few times has the main sheet, reefs (2) and main halyard all on one clutch set on the port side. That way it is easy to raise, lower, reef, and sheet all from the same position without moving about the cockpit.

Great idea on skipping the fairleads. I hadn't really thought about how they might not be needed! And I love turning nouns into verbs! :D
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby Tomfoolery » Fri Aug 09, 2013 2:40 pm

This is mine, before I bought it actually. The main halyard rope clutch is on the starboard side, but for reasons beyond me, they aimed it overboard instead of at the single cheek block (middle arrow) which turns the halyard toward the turning block at the mast base. The other end is aimed right at the winch, which I suppose is why they did that. I never use the winch for the halyard, so I may straighten it out.

Works fine, as the clutch hole has a generous flare at both ends, but annoying just-because. :D

Image
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby RobertB » Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:43 pm

tkanzler wrote:This is mine, before I bought it actually. The main halyard rope clutch is on the starboard side, but for reasons beyond me, they aimed it overboard instead of at the single cheek block (middle arrow) which turns the halyard toward the turning block at the mast base. The other end is aimed right at the winch, which I suppose is why they did that. I never use the winch for the halyard, so I may straighten it out.

Works fine, as the clutch hole has a generous flare at both ends, but annoying just-because. :D


Looks like they pointed it at the winch so you would not sideways load it if using the winch - great except the back end (OK, towards the bow) is loaded the same because it feeds at an angle
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby Tomfoolery » Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:50 pm

Yeah, another cheek block to steer it into the clutch would have been nice. I used to load it pretty hard when I used the winch to raise the mast, though I don't any more. I still use the clutch for that, but with 5 parts to the MRS, and I don't need the winch any more.

I also only raise the main by hand, and use the clutch to hold it, so maybe I'll remove the reorient it.

It bothers me. :D :wink:
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby AlaskaMC » Fri Aug 09, 2013 8:46 pm

tkanzler wrote:This is mine, before I bought it actually. The main halyard rope clutch is on the starboard side, but for reasons beyond me, they aimed it overboard instead of at the single cheek block (middle arrow) which turns the halyard toward the turning block at the mast base. The other end is aimed right at the winch, which I suppose is why they did that. I never use the winch for the halyard, so I may straighten it out.

Works fine, as the clutch hole has a generous flare at both ends, but annoying just-because. :D

Image


A pic is always worth a thousand. I don't have a winch on the cabin top and I think that is where I would place the clutch. Then it would line up beautifully. I never really imagine needing a winch for raising sails on this boat.

That is odd that the PO had it setup that way. Seems like it would put a lot of force on the line clutch.
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby Newell » Mon Aug 19, 2013 9:25 am

tkanzler wrote:This is mine, before I bought it actually. The main halyard rope clutch is on the starboard side, but for reasons beyond me, they aimed it overboard instead of at the single cheek block (middle arrow) which turns the halyard toward the turning block at the mast base. The other end is aimed right at the winch, which I suppose is why they did that. I never use the winch for the halyard, so I may straighten it out.

Works fine, as the clutch hole has a generous flare at both ends, but annoying just-because. :D

Image


I just had my coffee so extra sharp today. Looking closely at your pic I see what I think is the bow for a dodger? So I'm thinking the PO routed the halyard as far outside, as shown to get around it. With the dodger up, perhaps the clutch will be a safety foothold when going forward in a blow. Other than that I don't care for the routing. I have the same dodger, but have never installed it, so now I'm thinking of more reasons not to install.

Leading halyards aft is necessary for increased safety and control. I use my jib halyard (led back on starboard i.e. double clutch(s) on both my boats) for several functions. Since I hank-on I use it to raise the jib. Also used to adjust the tension on the luff, lower the mast, raise the mast and tension the spar in trailering position to eliminate bounce. :idea:
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Re: Leading Halyards Aft

Postby RobertB » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:27 am

I just finished the install of the BWY kit for halyards aft - with changes. I purchased the 3 cleat/clutch kit but am only using two at the time - third in reserve for later single line reefing or downhaul.
Instead of adding the double horizontal block in front of the single block that turns the dagger board line to the aft, I replace the single block with the double block since the bolt spacing was the same. I figure I can add the single block on top of the double later since the double vertical block at the mast is aimed at this location.
I also installed the cleats/clutches (Spinlock calls the PXR line cleats, BWY sells them as clutches) differently. BWY recommends to locate these on the side deck 12 inches in front of the starboard winch. I really did not want these in the middle of where we walk, especially with up to three lines fanning across the side deck. Also, I consider the one weakness of these cleats that they can open if bumped into. Instead, I installed them directly in front of the winch next to the existing dagger board cleat. I made a wood cored fiberglass layup for the mounting block (did not have a small piece of Starboard) - this bolts to the deck with three #10 machine screws. I also rigged the dagger board with a block for a 2 to 1 lifting ratio to make pulling up the dagger board easier. End result is pretty robust with a minimal footprint and relatively protected from someone bumping into them. The halyard cleat/clutch is also located to feed onto the winch if needed.
Image
A third cleat/clutch could go between the two or on the deck immediately to the right.
I also installed a smaller Spinlock PXR for the foresail roller furler line on the port side.
Image
Now, I can access all the lines I need to from the helm (two genoa sheets, roller furler, and dagger board - do not see the reason yet on the main halyard except possibly in an emergency).
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