26m sailing performance

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mad dog
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26m sailing performance

Post by mad dog » Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:35 pm

Still deciding whether the 26M is the crusing boat for me and have been trawling the web to find some reasonable account of the 26M's sailing ability. I have no illusions about it being a racing yatch but I would like to know how it performs at all points of sailing and therefore whether I can expect to be able to enjoy some reasonable sailing in light to moderate winds. I have just returned from my first vist to the Whitsundays sailing on a Seawind 1000 which pointed quite well at 40 deg and sometimes better.

Can anyone provide some data for me to digest?

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dlandersson
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by dlandersson » Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:43 pm

What do you mean "40 degess"? My 26X points up to "30 degrees" and I believe a 26M does better. :|
mad dog wrote:Still deciding whether the 26M is the crusing boat for me and have been trawling the web to find some reasonable account of the 26M's sailing ability. I have no illusions about it being a racing yatch but I would like to know how it performs at all points of sailing and therefore whether I can expect to be able to enjoy some reasonable sailing in light to moderate winds. I have just returned from my first vist to the Whitsundays sailing on a Seawind 1000 which pointed quite well at 40 deg and sometimes better.

Can anyone provide some data for me to digest?

mad dog
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by mad dog » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:05 pm

Thanks dlandersson - that is encouraging. Finally, I have something to go on.
Anymore performance data hounds out there with more to tell me?

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yukonbob
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by yukonbob » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:24 pm

mad dog wrote:Still deciding whether the 26M is the crusing boat for me and have been trawling the web to find some reasonable account of the 26M's sailing ability. I have no illusions about it being a racing yatch but I would like to know how it performs at all points of sailing and therefore whether I can expect to be able to enjoy some reasonable sailing in light to moderate winds. I have just returned from my first vist to the Whitsundays sailing on a Seawind 1000 which pointed quite well at 40 deg and sometimes better.

Can anyone provide some data for me to digest?
I find the M does best at 40 to the wind. It'll do 45-50 but the headway is completely offset by speed. 40 seems to be the sweet spot. I should mention that the traveler helps a lot. As for light winds it'll average 16knts in dead calm waters :P . I'll run back to port in light winds but as for trying to beat headway in less than say…mmm... 5knt winds it's just to tempting and easy to fire up the outboard find better wind. Up here that can be within a few miles once you get out of the narrow channels or around a point.

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yukonbob
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by yukonbob » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:26 pm

Another thought if you're a strictly sailing performance is the D and the S are far better sailors, and even though I have an M, I like the interior layout of the X better (I think, as I've never been on one) But Just seems to make more sense.

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dlandersson
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by dlandersson » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:27 pm

Really good point - but the OP specified a "new" boat - and they aren't making the 26S or 26D any more. :cry:
yukonbob wrote:Another thought if you're a strictly sailing performance is the D and the S are far better sailors, and even though I have an M, I like the interior layout of the X better (I think, as I've never been on one) But Just seems to make more sense.

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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by Hamin' X » Sun Dec 02, 2012 10:02 pm

I think that you need to specify whether you are referring to apparent wind, or true wind.

~Rich

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Dimitri-2000X-Tampa
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by Dimitri-2000X-Tampa » Sun Dec 02, 2012 10:24 pm

dlandersson wrote:What do you mean "40 degess"? My 26X points up to "30 degrees" and I believe a 26M does better. :|
Don't think I've ever seen a 26X point that well. Do you have brand new sails and a jib sheeted inside of the shroud? I point much much worse than that with my 150 Genoa sheeted outside the shrouds and partially rolled up Genoa (not to mention that this and the main are blown out 12-13 year old sails with a lot of use on them). I need some new sails but I'm not quite sure what to get. I wonder what the biggest headsail is that will still sheet inside the shrouds, maybe 110%.

mad dog
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by mad dog » Sun Dec 02, 2012 11:46 pm

Thanks Yukonbob - understand the "sweet spot" idea and it sounds pretty right. But........

Would this help to illicit the data I am looking for? (Fill in the spaces if you know)
In 10 knots of wind a Macgregor 26M will consistently point (at best) at..........degrees to the true wind and maintain a consistent boat speed of.....knots.
In 15 knots of wind a Macgregor 26M will consistently point (at best) at..........degrees to the true wind and maintain a consistant boat speed of.....knots.
In 20 knots of wind a Macgregor 26M will consistently point (at best) at..........degrees to the true wind and maintain a consistant boat speed of.....knots.

*Assume "at best" to mean with minimum leeway.

I've been looking at a lot of yacht reviews and don't understand why this kind of data is not forthcoming (especially from independent reviewers)? Spent 5 days at the helm with Raymarine electronics 2 weeks ago and this info seemed readily accessible and not too difficult to understand!

Still like some advice if anyone can give it.

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yukonbob
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by yukonbob » Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:20 am

Ya 40 is about the best speed/ headway for fully sheeted 20-25knt w. 10 knts …maybe…25-30 degrees with fifteen somewhere in the middle.

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c130king
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by c130king » Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:49 am

Big factor in pointing on a Mac...IMHO...is the foresail. I don't point nearly as high with my 150 Genoa as my buddy TFlight with his Jib. Furling in a Genoa does not help very much...furled genoa is not very efficient...IMHO.

But I wouldn't give my 150 Genoa up for anything as I like the reaching and off-wind increase in performance it gives.

I have a very hard time pointing much higher than 40 degrees apparent...rarely can I hit 45 true. But that is not an issue for me. Not racing...just sailing. If I really need to get somewhere than I can "supplement" the need to point with an assist from my Mercury.

26M has a lot of windage...not too much below the water...and is very light. All these tend to reduce pointing ability.

Cheers,
Jim

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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by Hardcrab » Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:11 am

mad dog,
If you are really that concerned with sailing performance then perhaps you might reconsider buying a Mac M.
Sailing performance is not what these boats bring to the table.
Sure it points, but nothing to write home about.
Okay, we might need to take a few more tacks to get there.
But so what.
Most folks are tickled pink if they average 6.5 - 7 knots on any point of sail in a Mac M.

75-80% of any other sailboats that are fine tuned and well skippered will outsail a fine tuned and well skippered stock Mac M on any day.

But so what.

We're at least floating somewhere while enjoying family, friends and life while making the compromises we accepted disappear.
Last edited by Hardcrab on Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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dlandersson
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by dlandersson » Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:16 am

And THAT gets us into what does "40 degrees" mean. I have a wind direction indicator in my :macx: (previous owner) and the best performance is around 45-55 degrees (does well at 90 degrees also. but tends to heel). I can sail into the wind up to 30 degrees before I run into the danger of "irons". Sails nicely downwind but them the breeze effect tends to be lost and it FEELS slower. :|
Dimitri-2000X-Tampa wrote:
dlandersson wrote:What do you mean "40 degess"? My 26X points up to "30 degrees" and I believe a 26M does better. :|
Don't think I've ever seen a 26X point that well. Do you have brand new sails and a jib sheeted inside of the shroud? I point much much worse than that with my 150 Genoa sheeted outside the shrouds and partially rolled up Genoa (not to mention that this and the main are blown out 12-13 year old sails with a lot of use on them). I need some new sails but I'm not quite sure what to get. I wonder what the biggest headsail is that will still sheet inside the shrouds, maybe 110%.

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dlandersson
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by dlandersson » Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:17 am

And THATS a really good point. :P
Hardcrab wrote:mad dog,
If you are really that concerned with sailing performance then perhaps you might reconsider buying a Mac M.
Sailing performance is not what these boats bring to the table.
Sure it points, but nothing to write home about.
Okay, we might need to take a few more tacks to get there.
But so what.
Most folks are tickled pink if they average 6.5 - 7 knots on any point of sail in a Mac M.

75-80% of any other sailboats that are fine tuned and well skippered will outsail a fine tuned and well skippered stock Mac M on any day.

But so what.

We're at least floating somewhere while enjoying family, friends and life making the compromises we accepted disappear.

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mastreb
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Re: 26m sailing performance

Post by mastreb » Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:40 pm

So actual data from my anenometer on my 26M, rigged with stock sails, and with Mike Inmon having tuned the rigging, does the following:

Right about 50% of wind speed at all speeds and points of sail. The variation here is surprisingly small, from about 45% to 60%, but you can expect that when you're doing everything right, the efficiency is right about 50%. So you'll need a 13 knot wind to get hull speed out of her.

Points to about 50 degrees true wind. It's my belief that people who report less than this are reporting based on apparent wind. That's fine, but I like to work from true wind, and I've not seen pointing performance better than 50 degrees with my 150 roller reefing Genoa. I'm sure a 110 hank-on will do better.

The bottom line is that it's about the worst pointing sloop you can buy. You'll do a lot of tacking. Doesn't bother me for day sailing because I can just go the direction the wind takes me, but people dunk the iron genny A LOT with these boats in order to actually get somewhere.

I'd hate for someone to buy this fantastic boat without understanding that in advance. I love my Mac, but she's not a pointer.

Matt

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