your ideal motor sailer

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Wayne nicol
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your ideal motor sailer

Post by Wayne nicol » Mon Jul 27, 2015 12:41 pm

so i know this could get outta control, but i would love to hear feed back with regards to your personal ideas on your ideal trailerable , motor sailer. and maybe some short reasons if so inclined

i really love my mac, and we all have things we would change- and i do truly see that the mac was a high production boat, thats what really made them affordable- but if one was to take the next step up, based on lessons learnt from the mac, and other boats- what would be an ideal boat for you??

OK, i will start.

1. 33' long- approx
2.10' beam- max trailerable with just an annual permit
3.more trad styling top sides- personal taste
4.different sailplan options- i personally would go for a schooner rig- easier to handle more canvas, single handed- just personal preference here- but i do realize they suffer a bit upwind-remember gentlemen never tack anyway!!
5.more effective hull design- mac can be improved on a lot in this department
6. water ballast- works well, and possibly also combined with some permanent ballast
7.lee boards with assymmetrical foils- free up space below, and significantly higher sailing performance, higher speed under power( a knot or so!)
8. step through or fold down transom/swimstep
9.2 private "cabins"-( as the mac- one fore one aft)- with some locker space, and privacy doors
10.still do approx 15 knots under power
11. not important for me to beach the boat
12.proper galley- 2 sinks, 2 plate burner, freezer/fridge
13 full head with shower
14. under 10 000 lbs- still trailerable
15. more open, and functional cockpit
16.pilothouse with inside steering, but also option of removeable tiller for fine weather sailing
17. power- inboard diesel would be nice- but at the cost of space, outboards are convenient- but do take up transom space


lots of options on rig, foils, power, cockpit configurations etc etc

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captronr
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by captronr » Mon Jul 27, 2015 1:48 pm

Think you forgot the most important factor: COST.

Ron

Wayne nicol
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by Wayne nicol » Mon Jul 27, 2015 2:17 pm

yup good point, but was not chasing that( albeit a very important) factor- was thinking purely along the design lines- obviously within normal cost ranges- whats normal??? who knows
thanks
wayne

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dlandersson
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by dlandersson » Mon Jul 27, 2015 2:41 pm

I've never been clear on the "suffer a bit upwind" thing - my experience has been that it's my X's best speed. 8)

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kadet
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by kadet » Mon Jul 27, 2015 3:00 pm

It' called a Noelex 30

http://noelex.org.au/review-n30/

Image

Wayne nicol
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by Wayne nicol » Mon Jul 27, 2015 3:34 pm

close!
a maxi trailer sailer. but i still want the high speed power option, a trailerable motor sailer.
and my choice of rig of course.
DL , the up wind performance was with reference to schooner rigs

thanks
wayne

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dlandersson
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by dlandersson » Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:50 pm

The deluxe sail away model which we tested costs $43,470 including sales tax. - not bad. 8)
kadet wrote:It' called a Noelex 30

http://noelex.org.au/review-n30/

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kadet
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by kadet » Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:38 pm

Wayne nicol wrote:close!
a maxi trailer sailer. but i still want the high speed power option, a trailerable motor sailer.
and my choice of rig of course.
DL , the up wind performance was with reference to schooner rigs

thanks
wayne
Everything is a compromise and you did say "Your" plus a 20-30hp Diesel is ample for me :)

Seriously thinking of getting one of these in a few years as my retirement boat. :P

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kadet
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by kadet » Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:41 pm

dlandersson wrote:The deluxe sail away model which we tested costs $43,470 including sales tax. - not bad. 8)
kadet wrote:It' called a Noelex 30

http://noelex.org.au/review-n30/
Sadly they are no longer made but a good used one runs you about $50k-$60K fully optioned

Wayne nicol
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by Wayne nicol » Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:48 pm

yer correct sir- i did say "your" :)
and its all great feedback,
but i would also really like to hear input with regards to overall design ideas and concepts. deck layout, sail plans, accommodations etc etc
thanks
wayne

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kadet
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by kadet » Tue Jul 28, 2015 2:12 am

sail plans
I have always loved ketches 8) But 2 masts to rig on a trailer sailer :x

Wayne nicol
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by Wayne nicol » Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:24 pm

Dunno, but if the flying scotsman can rig his beast- two mast should be pretty easy :D

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mastreb
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by mastreb » Tue Jul 28, 2015 10:05 pm

I moved this post from the factory relocating thread...

I'd do a plumb bow with a higher, more "pugnacious" trawler-type profile, a pronounced pilothouse allowing a full 6'6" of standing interior headroom and forward interior visibility, hydraulic steering >in the pilot house< that actuates dual steered jack-plates port and starboard. These steered jackplates allow the mounting of dual rudders, dual outboards, dual torquedos, or essentially dual anything else. The jack-plates rise directly vertically up the transom and lift whatever is mounted on them out of the water.

Both sailing variants would use a single center rudder on a pintle with a tiller; motor steering is completely separate from rudder steerage. The "pure" sailing model loses the interior helm altogether and is always sailed from the tiller, while the motorsailer variant requires the boards be pulled up before motoring just as the MacGregor does.

Variations would include:

1) A pure sailboat, with a fixed lead fin bulb keel and a high-performance carbon fiber mast & rig. This model would be built with a single 10 hp outboard on one of the rudders with the other left open, and would have a fixed mast based, intended to be slipped. It would not come with a trailer. It mounts a large center rudder on a pintle with a tiller.

2) As a trailer sailor with a daggerboard, essentially the same as the 26M. Water ballast, dual 40hp motors and a center rudder on a tiller.

3) As a cabin cruiser/fisher, with the cockpit shelled over with a removable hard FRG Bimini mounting a number of pole holders. This model would be permanently ballasted with a sealed ballast tank, and would ship with dual 60hp outboards. No rudders or keel, this boat has small skegs placed to allow for proper mobility.

4) As an "E-Trawler", with dual Torqueedo electric motors and a hard Bimini over the cockpit supporting 2Kw of solar generation, and holding 8 deep cycle batteries to keep a charge. This boat does 6 knots maximum, goes 90 nautical miles on a full charge, and can recharge to full in four days or to 80% in two days in either SoCal or Florida.

Using the same mould for all four and having separate lines to build them allows you to adapt to changes in market trends and demographics. The factory would offer "rebuilds" to convert hulls back-and-forth between the various types.

This would allow an open center transom and the inclusion of a drop tail-gate/swim platform. The center transom would have a pintle that could mount a large rudder or a small outboard in a fixed position.

Wayne nicol
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by Wayne nicol » Tue Jul 28, 2015 10:10 pm

Now thats what i'm talkin' 'bout!!
great post Matt, great ideas... as always!
food for thought
thanks!

bahama bound
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Re: your ideal motor sailer

Post by bahama bound » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:19 am

I like the e idea .

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