Tacking in high winds

A forum for discussing topics relating to MacGregor Powersailor Sailboats
User avatar
Tomfoolery
Admiral
Posts: 6135
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:42 am
Sailboat: MacGregor 26X
Location: Rochester, NY '99X BF50 'Tomfoolery'

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Tomfoolery »

Neo wrote:I'll give it another go BOAT but I'm thinking I really need something to to slow down the release of those ropes.
I don't usually use the genoa, but with the working jib I leave it sheeted and come about, keeping it sheeted until it back-winds and helps bring the bow around. Then I cut it loose and sheet it in.

If you're going to cut an heavily-loaded sheet loose, make sure you have a turn or two around the winch drum, and even then, wear sailing gloves. A rope burn can ruin a good day sailing. :cry:

OK, any day sailing is a good day, but burned hands make it less good. :|
K9Kampers
Admiral
Posts: 2441
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:32 am
Sailboat: MacGregor 26X
Location: NH, former 26X owner

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by K9Kampers »

...and even then, wear sailing gloves. A rope burn can ruin a good day sailing...
Or jus put the beer can down fer a minute :D
User avatar
Neo
Admiral
Posts: 1093
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 4:29 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Neo »

Tomfoolery wrote:If you're going to cut an heavily-loaded sheet loose, make sure you have a turn or two around the winch drum
Thats a good tip Tom but remembering my goal is solo sailing I'm usually holding the wheel with one hand and reaching forward to the Jib ropes (held in their cams) with the other hand.

Is there a device I can get/make that will slow the release of that rope?... I'm thinking about principal used on the figure eight climbing descender (which I'll be using as a preventer on the boom) but it needs to be effective in just one direction.

All the best.
Neo
User avatar
Tomfoolery
Admiral
Posts: 6135
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:42 am
Sailboat: MacGregor 26X
Location: Rochester, NY '99X BF50 'Tomfoolery'

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Tomfoolery »

That pretty much exactly describes the winch drums - as long as the turn or two is in the right direction. :D :D

Oh, and I usually sail solo, even when I have others on-board. It's just easier without 'help'. :wink:
User avatar
BOAT
Admiral
Posts: 4967
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2012 5:12 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: Oceanside, CA MACMJ213 2013 ETEC60

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by BOAT »

Man! This post is bugging me because I run the big genoa exclusively and when I turn the boat I always do it by myself - I'm really perplexed why your sails are fouling -

For me it's all an automatic reflex - I have been doing the same thing for SO many years (since I was 9 years old) so I am going to slow down a minute and imagine myself coming about and think real hard about what I do.

I am imagining that I am on a starboard tack - wind is in my face from the front and I am on a close reach.

I am sitting on the helm seat - I'm running south down the north San Diego coastline and I am going to make a turn out to sea so I am looking out towards the ocean -
As I am looking at the coastline getting closer I am gauging when to make my turn because I know the wind will die when I get close to the shore as I inch closer to the coast I make sure I'm going as FAST as I can -

Then, when I think I'm ready I spin the wheel HARD over to port and I yank the starboard genoa sheet out of the cleat at almost the same time - well I yank the line out of the cleat - but I don't really compleatly let it loose until the nose is already started turning now that I think about it.

The boat swings FAST over to port - it turns so fast that I almost go too far - the swinging of the bow through the air from one side to the other actually makes the genoa open up like a balloon on the starboard side of the boat and I need to start pulling on the port genoa sheet to get the sail to start sliding around the mast to the port side.

In that moment I am looking almost north bacu UP the coast nearly going in the opposite direction I was going before the tack! (As usual I turned too far!) I do it ALL THE TIME!

The sails are filling with air because at this point I am on a Port Beam Reach - the main is actually in too tight for the direction I am going - so I haul in on the excess flop in the genoa and slowly turn the boat back a little upwind until I am back on a close reach only this time to port. The entire maneuver takes about 6 to 10 seconds.

I adjust the sails, punch the auto pilot and walk away while the boat sails out to sea.

That's it. I have never not even once in my entire life EVER used the motor to come about - never. That's why this whole thread is driving me crazy.
User avatar
Neo
Admiral
Posts: 1093
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 4:29 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Neo »

Tomfoolery wrote:That pretty much exactly describes the winch drums - as long as the turn or two is in the right direction. :D :D
OK. So I'm assuming you're talking about a clockwise loop around the winch (against the ratchet)?.... Then slowly releasing it the lead.... I'll try that. In the past I've not been keen on keeping ropes on the winches but I think that was the wrong strategy :)

BTW when your'e "sailing solo" with other people sitting on deck, how many toes do you tread on / trip over :D
User avatar
BOAT
Admiral
Posts: 4967
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2012 5:12 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: Oceanside, CA MACMJ213 2013 ETEC60

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by BOAT »

Neo wrote:
Tomfoolery wrote:That pretty much exactly describes the winch drums - as long as the turn or two is in the right direction. :D :D
OK. So I'm assuming you're talking about a clockwise loop around the winch (against the ratchet)?.... Then slowly releasing it the lead.... I'll try that. In the past I've not been keen on keeping ropes on the winches but I think that was the wrong strategy :)

BTW when your'e "sailing solo" with other people sitting on deck, how many toes do you tread on / trip over :D
I don't use the winches and the genoa sheets are cleated to the rear behind the eye because I have those "eazy cleats" that most the folks here have - they are swivel cleats that go on the track behind the genoa eye.

With that set up everything is pointing to the helm seat. You can sit there and do the whole thing without asking anyone get up unless they are sitting on your lines (I make sure the lines are clear before I make the turn).

Then after the turn I often need to bother someone so I can reset the traveler.
User avatar
Neo
Admiral
Posts: 1093
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 4:29 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Neo »

BOAT wrote:I spin the wheel HARD over to port and I yank the starboard genoa sheet out of the cleat at almost the same time
Yep I did that.
BOAT wrote: - well I yank the line out of the cleat - but I don't really completely let it loose until the nose is already started turning now that I think about it.
I didn't do this :?
BOAT wrote: The boat swings FAST over to port - it turns so fast that I almost go too far - the swinging of the bow through the air from one side to the other actually makes the genoa open up like a balloon on the starboard side of the boat and I need to start pulling on the port genoa sheet to get the sail to start sliding around the mast to the port side.

In that moment I am looking almost north bacu UP the coast nearly going in the opposite direction I was going before the tack! (As usual I turned too far!) I do it ALL THE TIME!

The sails are filling with air because at this point I am on a Port Beam Reach - the main is actually in too tight for the direction I am going - so I haul in on the excess flop in the genoa and slowly turn the boat back a little upwind until I am back on a close reach only this time to port. The entire maneuver takes about 6 to 10 seconds.
Good information.... Thanks
BOAT wrote:Man! This post is bugging me
You need a holiday! .... Fly over here, spend a couple of days showing me how it's all done then you can take my Mac and sail the Eastern coast of Australia for a change .... You'll feel fine after that :D .... Genuine offer BTW :wink:
User avatar
BOAT
Admiral
Posts: 4967
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2012 5:12 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: Oceanside, CA MACMJ213 2013 ETEC60

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by BOAT »

Maybe that's the issue - your on the EAST COAST - over here we say the yanks on the East Coast have a harder time sailing because the ocean on the East Coast is a lot meaner than the ocean on the West Coast.

Have you ever sailed the WA?
User avatar
Doug W
Captain
Posts: 632
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 7:08 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: Prairie Home MO - Galactica - 2010 26M with Etec 60
Contact:

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Doug W »

K9Kampers wrote:
Or jus put the beer can down fer a minute :D
And risk spilling it??!!! :o

Doug & Angie
Galactica Hull#2569 :macm:
K9Kampers
Admiral
Posts: 2441
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:32 am
Sailboat: MacGregor 26X
Location: NH, former 26X owner

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by K9Kampers »

And risk spilling it??!!!
Awww com'on! Doncha have a beer holder onboard?!!

Image
User avatar
Neo
Admiral
Posts: 1093
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 4:29 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Neo »

BOAT wrote:Have you ever sailed the WA?
Would love to but alas I have not :( ...and it's a 7 day drive from here. .... Maybe one day... or maybe NZ (it's actually closer!). Just need to fit the Mac in a Qantas Jumbo :D
Baha
First Officer
Posts: 237
Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2014 2:58 am
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: UK

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Baha »

Doug W wrote:
K9Kampers wrote:
Or jus put the beer can down fer a minute :D
And risk spilling it??!!! :o

Doug & Angie
Galactica Hull#2569 :macm:
We need a course on how to tack while holding a cold one..:) I am not sure I could tack with one hand....maybe if I held the main sheet AND the beer in one....then it's a dilemma...sheet vs. beer

Maybe I'll just upgrade my autopilot to one with an auto tack and install all electric winches, etc like the big boys....
Nauti Nell
Engineer
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2016 3:44 pm
Sailboat: MacGregor 26M
Location: Decatur, Ga

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Nauti Nell »

This should give you hands free beer ability.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Beer-Soda-Guzzl ... SwFAZTuve9

8) :P
User avatar
Tomfoolery
Admiral
Posts: 6135
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:42 am
Sailboat: MacGregor 26X
Location: Rochester, NY '99X BF50 'Tomfoolery'

Re: Tacking in high winds

Post by Tomfoolery »

Baha wrote:We need a course on how to tack while holding a cold one..:) I am not sure I could tack with one hand....maybe if I held the main sheet AND the beer in one....then it's a dilemma...sheet vs. beer
I mostly use the working jib, so tacking with one hand is easy. Seriously. No main sheet adjustment needed, at least until after the tack is completed. And I leave the jib sheet cleated until it's back-winded and pushing the bow around. The helm stays where I put it for the most part during the tack, except in high winds. So the only work is cutting the sheet loose, and taking up slack in the other sheet, which is already passed around the winch, and I pull slack through the cam cleat so anywhere I stop, it stays. Head into the wind a little to take in more sheet, then fall off. When the boat comes around far enough, I reach over and spin the wheel to arrest the turn.

But two hands are definitely easier. :wink: And I'm not racing, so a sloppy tack is OK. With me, at least. :P
Neo wrote:So I'm assuming you're talking about a clockwise loop around the winch (against the ratchet)?.... Then slowly releasing it the lead.... I'll try that. In the past I've not been keen on keeping ropes on the winches but I think that was the wrong strategy :)
Yes, one CW turn around the winch. But I'm using the working jib, not the genoa, so the cam cleat is right behind the winch, and the winch acts as a fairlead to direct the sheet into the cam cleat. It also provides no resistance (to speak of) when taking in the sheet, and plenty of resistance when letting some out, which is desirable when it's really tight. It's no different than trying to stop a moving boat (a heavy one) at a dock by pulling on a dock line, which can pull you into the water, and taking a turn or even a half-turn on a dock cleat and controlling the pay out to gradually stop the boat, without getting pulled into the water. Like in all those youtube videos of boater mess-ups. :P

Neo wrote:BTW when your'e "sailing solo" with other people sitting on deck, how many toes do you tread on / trip over :D
All the toes that are on the cockpit sole when I'm tacking solo. :D Sometimes, I have one person standing by to cut the sheet loose at my command, while I'm sitting on the windward side, so once it comes about, I'm on the leeward side and can do what I need to do on the new working sheet without even moving from my seat next to the helm, where I usually sit, steering with one hand.

I really need some bimbo (stern rail) seats on this boat. My last one had them, and they were the best seats in the house. Not so easy to add to the X, unfortunately. Many M boats have them, however. :)

Edit: Oh, and I don't drink when I'm sailing, so having both hands free is rarely a problem. But if I have a bottle of water, it's in a holder that clips onto the bimini tubes, so still no worries. :wink:
Last edited by Tomfoolery on Wed Mar 08, 2017 6:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
Post Reply