Repowering with the Tohatsu TLDI 90

[Mark Prouty]

This article doesn't pertain here because it doesn't mention the new 2 stroke outboards but it does bring up a question. Are there lakes where new 2 stroke won't be allowed?
http://www.smalloutboards.com/4Stroke.htm

Choosing a Two-Stroke Outboard Engine

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When you are not required to operate in a "4-Stroke Only" body of water

[Chip Hindes]

As far as I know, the only reasonably sized lake which does not allow the older style two strokes is Lake Tahoe, CA. I don't know if this ban is specifically directed at two strokes or simply based on tested EPA pollution numbers. Does anyone know? The latter would make more sense, in which case the TLDI-type two strokes should be allowed, but politicians and lobbyists are involved, and when that happens sense has very little to do with it. I would guess that some number of smaller lakes which are subject to local pols have done it or might do it in the future, just as many already have strict and small limits on motor HP. That doesn't really affect Mac owners so much unless they try to sail in puddles.

As far as other good sized lakes banning even the old smokey two strokes, my personal feeling is that there's little chance the legislation to do so would ever pass. There are over 80 years worth of two strokes, a good number of them are still running, and their owners will have a lot to say about it.

I'm not big on conspiracy theories, but I wouldn't be surprised if you could trace much of the hooraw about the potential of banning two strokes back to the marketing departments of the four stroke manufacturers.

[Frank C]

... I'm not big on conspiracy theories, but I wouldn't be surprised if you could trace much of the hooraw about the potential of banning two strokes back to the marketing departments of the four stroke manufacturers.

Except for the fact that all of the manufacturers actually produce both types of motors. Sure, the ban on one type would cost them the value in their base of R&D, but it's probably not like obsoleting entire factories.

I suspect the manufacturers are genuinely trying to appeal to their markets with the best performance solution. My personal bias against the 2-stroke has to do with noise and mid-range performance. Those criteria mean ZERO to the bass boaters, who are probably a large component of the outboard marketplace.

[Chip Hindes]

Except for the fact that all of the manufacturers actually produce both types of motors.

Well, most of them do now. Except Honda, maybe? But these questions were around several years ago when the hooraw was in full swing, things were in more of a state of flux, and few manufacturers had full lines of engines of both types, and the potential the 2-S would be banned was a major selling point. They had to push it; the four strokes cost way more, most boat owners didn't give a rat's ass about how much pollution they might be creating, and as I've stated many times before though the difference in gas mileage is significant, it depends a lot on how you use your boat; if the only time it's at idle is while you're waiting for it to warm up so you can try to push the throttle lever through the firewall, you really won't notice how crummy is the part throttle gas mileage. In any event, no matter how you use it, if mileage is the only reason you bought the 4-S, it really does take a long time to pay for itself.

Even now I don't believe you'll find that all manufacturers make both types of motors through the entire HP range of their offerings, and there are still a hull of a lot of potential motor buyers who couldn't care less about pollution.

I'm sure most of us read and heard predictions that the two strokes wouldn't even be available in a few years, period. There was no acknowledgement whatsoever that cleaner more efficient two strokes were just around the corner. I had a San Diego Mac dealer tell me straight out, in fall 2000, that all two strokes were at that time or would soon be illegal for sale in CA, and two years after that they'd be banned outright.

Just as in everything else, as the technology develops you may need to reevaluate your positions on two strokes per se. I've seen data that says the TLDI-type two strokes are superior in both efficiency and pollution (assuming you do care) at all speeds.

The claims are that they're quiter as well, though if you read between the lines (there's that marketing obfuscation at work again) it appears they're quieter than conventional two strokes, not quieter than four strokes.

I'm not a proponent of two strokes. My carbureted Tohatsu 50D runs great, has cost me nothing, with no maintenance except annual winterization, but it's stinky, noisy, and gets truly lousy mileage. By far, it's the worst decision I made on the purchase of my new boat. Yet at the time four years ago the $2K difference seemed pretty significant, and right now I'm still having a hard time justifying its replacement. In fact it's hard for me to believe there are those who are dumping perfectly good four strokes for any reason.