West coast\ Salt water upgrades?

[Indulgence]

Wow. Am I so glad I asked questions. I would have had my Mac skewered on a rock for sure.

I'm dissapointed about the range on the old Nissan. I put over two hundred Nm on the boat this
summer and burned 2 tanks. Guess I sail a lot. But the point is well taken that I need to
be able to rely on the motor if I have to.

New list:
1. Bottom Paint
2. Dodger
3. Replace rigging
4. Weight Keel
5. Dinghy
6. Jerry cans- 12 gallons
7. Go sailing

You guys are great, I appreciate it!
Laurie

[Kelly Hanson East]

KHE: "tension rigging to 10% of SWL to stop shock loading" I understand your point. The rigging will be 12
years old next spring so I plan on replacing it either way. I'm going to talk to some rigging people I was
referred to in Sidney. Just so I don't look like an idiot when I do- what the hull is 'SWL', Silly Wanker Load?

Im the Silly Wanker in this case

SWL is safe working load - in fact, you dont tension to 10% of SWL, you tension to 10% of Breaking load to stop shock loading.

(I also corrected in original post)

[Indulgence]

OK
Some water under the keel since last post. The mighty Mac is back in the shop and we're preparing to undertake
that long list of upgrades and expenses to get her ready to trailer to our place on the west coast for the spring season.
I've hit a brick wall, I'd like some input or opinions.

The LIST: The COST
1. Bottom Paint : $ 1,000
2. Dodger, doors, bimini & connector: 2,000
3. Replace rigging: 1,500
4. Weight Keel: 500
5. Dinghy, motor: 5,000
6. Jerry cans- 12 gallons: 100
7. Dickinson cabin heat: 1000
Total $11,000 plus labor.

Trailer travel from Alberta to Vancouver Island and back: 6 days
Fuel $ 500
Ferry 800
Rooms 400
Lost earnings: 5,200
Total: $ 6,900

Eighteen Thousand dollars puts a huge dent in the cost of a coastal "keel boat".

This post is not intended to generate a discussion about the accuracy of my cost estimates for the various
items listed. But right or wrong I'm starting to think I'm travelling down the wrong road. The Mac is perfect for camping
out on the lake and pounding around in the wind. It's perfect to lug to the Okanagan for a week. As a matter
of fact when I mention to sailors here on the Coast that I have a Mac, I mostly get a huge grin and rave
reviews. Turns out here in the Pacific Northwest they seem to be a popular and well liked cruiser.

Which would be fine if I lived here full time.
But I don't.

Tomorrow or Wednesday I am starting serious negotiations to buy a 1983 Cooper 316 Pilothouse. Has pretty
well everything on my wish list except GPS, Autopilot, cockpit enclosure and electric windlass. So the question
is, especially to those of you who sail and cruise in the PNW,

Have you any comments, suggestions, knowledge of, cautions against or kudos for these boats?
Do any of you have friends or marina mates with a Cooper? or a Discovery? with tales to tell?
What is your opinion of the pilothouse style? Pros and Cons?
I've stormed and pillaged the internet for information but if you can think of any resources I
might have missed I'd appreciate the heads up.

Thanks in advance to a good bunch of thoughtful guys. I wouldn't be here without you!
Laurie

[Chinook]

Comparing apples to oranges is always a difficult task. Two of your biggest ticket items deserve comment. Budget for dinghy and motor, at $5000, is generous. You could certainly spend that much, but could get by for less, and I assume that you would still need same with a keelboat. Lost wages at $5200 for 6 days of trailer travel may be offset by additional moorage costs for a keelboat stored in the water or remote dry storage, versus a Mac on the trailer and in your driveway. Also, the listed items for your Cooper could easily tally $10,000, plus your $5000 budget for dinghy and motor. That said, a pilothouse configuration is certainly ideal for coastal northwest waters, from a comfort standpoint. Good luck on your decision.

[Highlander]

Here we go
http://www.usedvictoria.com/classified-ad/9811727

some nice pic's in this link
http://sailbellacoola.com/BoatDetails.html

http://www.mikeaston.ca/taking-lines-af ... ilboat.php

A little pricey for a 1983 !

nice boat though !

J

[waternwaves]

a 32 ft keel boat does not sit unattended cheaply.

the full enclosure helps
radar is necessary if you are going to play year round, especially if you need to get somewhere
epoxy and bottom paint is necessary,
wallas heater/stove
wicking pads to keep the cushions off the condensation on the fiberglass.
and if you are going to leave the cushions under the enclosure, replace the mac cockpit cushions with closed cell foam cushions with sumbrella covers.
put the hot water heater in.
and 24 gallons of fuel.
larger/more- anchor/line.

now she will go out with you all winter.

[Indulgence]

Chinook- of course you're right. But in my situation there is no driveway to store the Mac.
It has to be moored full time each trip. I found a place I can keep the trailer (only).
And yeah, five grand for a dinghy and motor is a lot. I must be thinking in West Marine
bucks. The Cooper has a nearly new dinghy / 15HP motor. It has assumable live-
aboard moorage c/w sewer hookup for ~$4,000 / year. She's moored outside my window.

I think comfort is one of the main concerns I have. Considering I don't live here
full time we need to be able to use the boat in fair weather and foul. If we are forced to
wait out a chilly rainy Saturday we won't get to go at all because we've got to catch a plane
Monday morning. Plus I want Janet to be completely warm, comfy and cosy no matter what.
If the Admiral's happy, I'm happy.

Highlander- you found her! That's the boat in your link. I agree it seems a bit pricey.
I emailed him an offer for less last night. We'll see how it goes. There's a heck of nice
Catalina just around the corner if this falls through.

Thanks all,
Laurie

[Highlander]

Well How'd ya make out with the offer !
Sidney is a nice town


If ever I brought my out to the NWP I already have free docking slipp at my daughter's condo

J

[bubba]

The cost on the weighted daggerboard listed above is too mutch we bought 50 lbs of spent led bullets at an indoor shooting range was $10.00 for us. Also we do not have a motor on our dingy and get by very well.

[Indulgence]

A little back and forth negotiations on price, but the owner accepted an offer last night.
Naturally a round of very expensive scotch ensued.
Sea trials Saturday. I'm off to engage a diesel mechanic to check the thumpy bits.
Don't know whether to be elated or terrified.
L.

[bubba]

Lets see a photo.

[Indulgence]

Bubba, et al,

Photos link
http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/sredir?u ... feat=email

We sail Saturday at 0930. If you're interested check back and I'll let you know how
she compares to the MacGregor 26X. The owner has talked a seasoned competative
sailor from "down the end of the dock" into running her out with us. This fellow
has taken her out before and the Owner says he can her get up and flying much
better than he can. The Owner admits he's just not a sailor. He gave this a try
for a couple of years but is going back to a 35-40 foot motor cruiser.
His loss , my gain! Told him to be sure and let me know when he's heading out
in his new boat so I can tie a line to his sternrail.

PS Bubba- good thinking on the used lead from the gun range. My plan is to buy
lead shotgun shot from a re-loading place. Then mix it with epoxy and pour it into
the centerboard a bit at a time. Clamp the sides so they don't bulge. Do it slowly
so there's no heat build up. I thought I would be adding a hundred to a hundred
and fifty pounds so between the shot and the epoxy it's going to cost a couple
of bucks. How did you do yours?

Laurie

[bubba]

Nice cruser !
Our Daggerboard is doing great, it stiffened up the boat at about 12+ degrees of heal ( perfect achording to Roger MacGregor on the web site) and allows us to not reef sooner by at least one reef. The thing BWY's Tod says the daggerboard lifting pully above it bends and deforms and freezes up in the down position at the worst time if too much weight is added. I was also advised with the extra 50 lbs of lead you would need to stiffen up that stainless pully bracket by welding vertical pieces for stiffness ( it's stainless steel ) and soft but very weldable. When adding our lead pieces they were not regular shaped ( spent gun amo from an indoor range) and it left gaps I am sure, but it was cheep and left gaps to pour in the liquid hardner. With shotgun lead shot it may be easier to pour in but check the price for lead shot ( ouch ) not steel, steel rusts. Always use rubber gloves and a mask working with lead. Total weight 72 pounds the board weights 22 or so std, adding the 6 to 1 helps tons with adjusting the daggerboard to down wind sailing. We trailer with the daggerboard resting on the crossbar on the trailer and this takes the weight off the pully when bumping down the road and has not bent the pully yet, but I am welding it before we sail again.

[waternwaves]

Laurie,

If you get a chance, that protected little dock that John is talking about is about the the most pretty and quant moorage in all of victoria. Beautiful little waterfall running there a couple of times a day.

Your boat handling skills will greatly improve in the upper end of the inner harbor. There is a bridge there , that I swear doesnt have 18 ft of horizontal clearance.

Good thing John took us through the first time in the dark, so I didnt know how tight it was.

One warning tho.
As a mac lover(for all of its many features) it is frequently difficult now to get the admiral to accompany me on the MAC unless the weather is perfect. Having a larger vessel in the fleet, which is fully outfitted, tends to make the transition back to the mac a little difficult for her at times. Comfort seems to frequently overrule capability and locations it seems.

|>arren

[Highlander]

Here you are

http://s78.photobucket.com/albums/j95/m ... 67b15f.flv

Here's the bridge
http://s78.photobucket.com/albums/j95/m ... 0871e4.flv

J