rocna anchor avoid

[Ixneigh]

Well i just pulled my rocna 25 again and started dragging across the flats. Probably blowing 40 plus. I was in the lee of some msngrove islands but still didnt hold. It was clogged with a ball of muck and was just dragging. I pulled it all up in the driving rain and motored back and threw it in the mangroves. Ill sort it out later. Its still blowing pretty hard. Boat was heeling as if under sail. With her bow in the trees its better.
That rocna has done this bit before. I now am convinced its a dangerous anchor for muddy or mucky bottoms. I will replace it with a delta.
Just a heads up. They might be fine for rock and sand. If anchoring in turtle grass or similar do not use it as an overnight anchor without an anchor watch.

Ixneigh

[ROAD Soldier]

I have a delta and a fluke anchor. For mud I would use the delta because the fluke would dig in mud so well it would be hard to retrieve.

[Boblee]

Interesting as I had dragged our Sarca anchor a couple of times on very bare flat/hard clay and now also have a Rocna which I found was holding better in most conditions surprisingly but on some experiments we did a few years ago found the Sarca much better at setting and resetting than the delta type anchors especially in sand?
Have had trouble in heavy weed but usually found by making sure the anchor is well set it holds but if any doubt definitely set two anchors especially if tide or wind changes expected.
Also interestingly found a smaller Sarca from the dinghy sometimes holds better than the large one?
Don't know that you could reliably trust any anchor in some heavy weed especially if it needs to reset and especially on a Mac (dance) which causes the anchor to reset if theres wind or tide anyway, once the anchor is fouled it's going to be difficult to reset.

[mastreb]

Interesting as I had dragged our Sarca anchor a couple of times on very bare flat/hard clay and now also have a Rocna which I found was holding better in most conditions surprisingly but on some experiments we did a few years ago found the Sarca much better at setting and resetting than the delta type anchors especially in sand?
Have had trouble in heavy weed but usually found by making sure the anchor is well set it holds but if any doubt definitely set two anchors especially if tide or wind changes expected.
Also interestingly found a smaller Sarca from the dinghy sometimes holds better than the large one?
Don't know that you could reliably trust any anchor in some heavy weed especially if it needs to reset and especially on a Mac (dance) which causes the anchor to reset if theres wind or tide anyway, once the anchor is fouled it's going to be difficult to reset.

I've had zero trouble with my danforth (Fortress 11) in sand, but then I've also not been anchored against a storm. Also seems to set in weeds pretty well. It's got mud palms on it, maybe that's a big difference? It's worked so well that I've not changed anchors since I put it on.

I also use a 7lb. galvanized grapnel as a kellet by putting a screw shackle on it and sending it down the rode once the anchor is set. Size the shackle such that it can slip freely on the rode but will stop at the first link in the chain.

It holds the rode chain down to the sea bed and seems to dramatically increase holding power. It's pretty easy to get up, as the grapnel pulls up first, and then the danforth pulls up. Granted, it is 7lbs. more on the rode so weighing by hand is a bit harder--My admiral sometimes can't get it hauled all the way up and I have to do the last little bit. If you use a grapnel as a kellet the grapnel will come up with the tines splayed even if you screw down the collet, so you will have to manually close it before you get all the chain out of the water.

In any case, if you're having problems with an anchor dragging, definitely try sending a kellet down the rode. They work like a charm and increase the hold in all seabed types. I like the grapnel as a kellet because the tines work a bit as a weed anchor and because I think every bit of weight on a boat needs to do double duty at least, but is is a bit of extra hassle and literally any weight on a shackle will work.

[Ixneigh]

Its not the dragging im have issues with. Its that the rocna pops out suddenly and needs to be cleared befor it can be reset.
Ill try the delta for a while and report on its function in muddy grasss.
I anchor near or on grass flats since it wont hurt the boat if the tide goes out and there is little sand in tbe keys. I had a thirty five on my much larger yawl and liked it. Yes its a tough order for an anchor but thats what it has to do.
I dont like using two anchors. If i have to use a heavier anchor on lighter chain i will do that.
Ixneigh

[Sumner]

We had good luck in almost 3 months of anchoring in Florida with our 25 lb. Manson Supreme. Love that anchor. A number of times we were in tight places and put down our 22 lb. claw as a second anchor on a Bahamian Moor...



..... to keep us from swinging and that always worked also. A few times we put the claw and the Manson down about 60 deg. apart out in front of us.

We like to go to bed and not worry during the night. We can now put down the second anchor and/or retrieve both in probably under 5 minutes and don't mind doing that,

Sum

Our Endeavour 37

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Our MacGregor S Pages

Mac-Venture Links

[Boblee]

Not sure what a fortress11 is but have used danforth type anchors with very limited success in fact the first night I camped out in the boat it dragged out of weed and mud and I ended up in some willows, have tried the Danforth a few times since but the best use I found was up the beach in soft sand when parking rear in for beaching.
Absolutely not a patch on the Sarca or the Rocna as a general purpose especially with the movement and swinging of the Macs.
Of course I would certainly try it in the local conditions though as what works in some areas won't elsewhere and weed is different so yeah could be a Delta may resist fouling but once fouled and out may still be hard to reset.
Be interested to see how it goes as all info greatly appreciated, the Sarca dragged last time in the Cambridge Gulf with 8M tide in a muddy bottom but found it was fouled with a plastic bag, almost came to grief with a tanker when I woke we were right in front .
Only set the one anchor as was going to move but relaxed and slept after a particularly hairy passage with a raging tide and narrow rocky channell in pitch black trying to work off chartplotter but spinning , oh well we survived without a scratch AGAIN.

[mastreb]

oh well we survived without a scratch AGAIN.

That's a whole lot of anchoring failure. What kind of scope are you typically using? I go for 7:1 as often as possible, 5:1 at an absolute minimum. The entire chain should be resting on the seabed and you should have a near parallel line between the rode and the seabed. I'm sure you probably know this, but more scope generally equals more hold.

[Boblee]

I would have had out a minimum of 5:1 but probably more and that would have been at the top of the probably 8M+? tide so at the low tide where we stopped was well over that.
We had anchored in roughly the same spot several times prior with both one and two anchors (across the tide flow with two) and no problems as it was a good bottom but it was the plastic which prevented the anchor biting in that was the problem I think it was right across the point.
Another reason to use two anchors as I imagine the anchor picked up the plastic on resetting when the tide changed yes have 6M of heavy chain on both anchors but whether that sits on the bottom in that current especially if it gets a tail wind
We rum 56M of rode (chain and rope) and even in that shallow (4M) would have had most out as there was plenty of swinging room, I bought the Rocna just for that location with it's fast tides.

[Divecoz]

I am Having great success with my Bruced Claw Clone..I do have 2 Danforth wannabes as back ups..
Claw has 30 feet of chain..... both Wannabes have 15 feet.. I use a Home made snubber to reduce line/rode shock to about.... zero.. That Seems To Be huge Issue..

[Phil M]

I am Having great success with my Bruced Claw Clone..I do have 2 Danforth wannabes as back ups..
Claw has 30 feet of chain..... both Wannabes have 15 feet.. I use a Home made snubber to reduce line/rode shock to about.... zero.. That Seems To Be huge Issue..

How exactly do you use a home-made snubber to reduce the shock load?

Phil M

[c130king]

And a picture of a snubber would be good as well if anyone has one. Seems like my cheap rode is somewhat "stretchy" so probably have never notice a a need for one.

Cheers,
Jim

[jschrade]

The bottom really matters - grass is tough on all anchors.

I started with a Guardian G11 and it was too small and dragged even in sand and 26' of chain. Moving to the G16 was the answer. These are really light but it doesn't fit in the anchor locker. No practical anchor will.

With the guidance of local sailors, I moved to a 16.5lb Bruce (Lewmar Claw) and have been very happy with it. The G16 is backup and I should use it more like Sumner does for overnight anchoring.

After changing from the G11 to G16, I have only drug once and that was rafted up to a much larger fishing boat for the night (bad judgement). The wind changed and picked up and the reset happened in grass (bad luck). This ended up being a tremendous adventure at 3:00am that has gotten lots of mileage with our club! Imagine high tide, lee shore, fishing boat stuck, my boat barely floating but will not point into the wind. Eventually got me pushed off and i took on the role of Seatow to pull the fishing boat off. It took every bit of my 60HP to do it.

It took we two drops for find sand and I didn't get much sleep as I watched the sounder for quite a bit. As mentioned the track feature on the Garmin zoomed in will quickly tell you the story. If you see a straight line - you are dragging.


Jim

[Divecoz]

Phil.. I dont do pictures, though I should..
I..... Lost a Bunch of them years ago, with an , "internet picture site" that was short lived..
Basics idea.. Its a Black rubber(?) Truckers Bunggie with the metal S hooks on each end.. I closed them ( S hooks) enough to stay where I attach them.. I attach them in the chain.. I do this in such a manner as to allow about.. 3 to 5 feet of movement before the chain is taught.. This eliminates most the jerking.. By The Rules? Our boats should be using 3/8 " rode/line for anchors.. I ... cannot grip that well..Not with my hands, so I and a few/ maybe many others use 1/2" line.. very little stretch in that for our purposes.. MY Snubber allows some, give and take all by its self and IMHO it's better than using smaller line..

[Tomfoolery]

The bottom really matters - grass is tough on all anchors.

Is there anything out there that reliably holds in grass? I always thought something like a yachtsman would dig through and hold, but they're big and clunky, and I doubt anyone would want to deal with that.