First day actually sailing! And some questions for the old timers

[returnofthemac]

I took her out today and was able to raise the main and sail around some! Great day on the water using only the main for now! Huge thank to Jimmy for helping me better understand the roller furler main sail I have a bunch of questions about the general experience that I'd like to run by some of seasoned Mac owners.

I did struggle a lot with the roller furler. I'm just not used to it. I am failing to see any benefit of them, but I am a newbie so I'll assume this is supposed to be easier or something. I dont know if they function differently on other boats, or if this one wasn't installed properly but they are a significant pain in the ass. Not to mention that the mast from BWY really struggles with feeding the sail, too. If it is not perfectly aligned in the groove, it jams. Which means leaving the cockpit. Which defeats the purpose of a roller furler. But, the sail was raised, and sailing was done and that counts for something!

In the wind, I had some trouble letting the main sheet out. I couldn't really get it all the way out to run. The lines from the traveller to the boom make contact with the lifelines. That just didn't seem right to me so I keep the mainsail pretty close and only sailed close hauled. See the photo for the setup.

Also, the wind was relatively light today but would gust up to 15 mph. It was a steady wind with a steady current. This just added to my struggles with navigating around the dock. I launch the boat solo from the trailer and it is my least favorite part of boating. It kind of ruins it, to be honest. Docking is an absolute nightmare. I tried filling the ballast and dropping the rudders this time and it didn't' really make it that much more controllable. It seems like the 26M catch a LOT of wind on the broadside and seem very difficult to control at low speeds in comparison to other boats. So I consistently have a really tough time at the dock. Like often it just does not go where I want it to and I'm being pushed along by the wind, whereas other boats are able to more or less stay in the same place.

The primary reason I bought a Macgregor was for trailerability, but I'm really losing patience with public docks. I'm thinking of getting a membership at a private marina so that I can dock in peace, but that will confine me from launching at one spot, which is basically the same as having a fixed keel boat moored in a marina!

Is there a way to make docking easier, or should I just find a private dock and launch in peace?

[Russ]

Your main sheet is upside down. The cam block should be down on the traveler.

Yes going slow loses traction and the wind bows you around. Goes against instinct. Try a bit more speed

I assume you have the motor attached to the steering. If not that will lose much control.

It will get easier.

[Jimmyt]

I did struggle a lot with the roller furler. I'm just not used to it. I am failing to see any benefit of them, but I am a newbie so I'll assume this is supposed to be easier or something. I dont know if they function differently on other boats, or if this one wasn't installed properly but they are a significant pain in the ass. Not to mention that the mast from BWY really struggles with feeding the sail, too. If it is not perfectly aligned in the groove, it jams. Which means leaving the cockpit. Which defeats the purpose of a roller furler. But, the sail was raised, and sailing was done and that counts for something!

Did you raise the back of the boom when raising/lowering the sail? You may need some sail dry lube in the slot and on the bolt rope. Has your bolt rope shrunk and caused the sail to bunch up? Do you have a pre-feeder and feeder where the bolt rope enters the slot?

I am still wondering whether the roller boom is worth keeping. Thus far, it’s been a challenge I've refused to back away from.

I won’t think less of you if you abandon it, though.

Very slow maneuvering in windy conditions is best done in reverse, if practicable.

[NiceAft]

By reversing the mainsheet, the cam block will be at the traveler, and the line will lay at your feet; easy to grab and control.

When pulling the topping lift to raise the boom, you will reduce much of the pressure on the mainsail. The sail will travel up and down the mast much easier. Just remember to release the topping lift when the sail is fully raised.

As to the the challenge to control your at low speeds in windy situations, it's not easy. First, all boards down. Second, ballast full. If that wind blows you into the dock, great If that wind is blowing you away from the dock
If you enjoy the head space in the cabin of your boat, that headroom is the price you pay in the wind. , boats have exposure to wind side drift in windy conditions because of the height of the cabin; our boats sit much higher in the water, that height acts like a sail.

When going into a slip, reverse is the way to go. Stand and move to to the front of the pedestal, face the stern, and you will have not only more control by going in reverse, but the steering is easier. Turn the wheel to the left, the boat goes to the left, etc. Obviously, this is not the way to put your Mac on the trailer.

[returnofthemac]

Your main sheet is upside down. The cam block should be down on the traveler.

Hah! That's good to know!

I found a long thread about docking on here. Backwards seems to be the way to go. Kind of unnerving because the rudders are right there ready to get mashed. I'll practice near a buoy and see how that goes.

[Jimmyt]

Looked at your first photo more closely. Looks like you are connected straight to your topping lift eye. That may be good for raising and lowering, but you need to get the topping lift slightly slack under sail. Your sail shape won't be good with the topping lift holding the boom up.

I've got a piece of dyneema about 2 feet long with a couple of loops in it, added to the topping lift. It gives me a couple of positions that keep it out of the Bimini, but slack when sailing.

You can see how slack my topping lift is when under sail, with the extra line on it. Ignore the extra lines on the sail at the clew. My two smiling buddies (both keel boaters) were trying to get the sail shape to their liking. I still had halyard issues at that time...

[Be Free]

I took her out today and was able to raise the main and sail around some! Great day on the water using only the main for now! Huge thank to Jimmy for helping me better understand the roller furler main sail I have a bunch of questions about the general experience that I'd like to run by some of seasoned Mac owners.

I did struggle a lot with the roller furler. I'm just not used to it. I am failing to see any benefit of them, but I am a newbie so I'll assume this is supposed to be easier or something. I dont know if they function differently on other boats, or if this one wasn't installed properly but they are a significant pain in the ass. Not to mention that the mast from BWY really struggles with feeding the sail, too. If it is not perfectly aligned in the groove, it jams. Which means leaving the cockpit. Which defeats the purpose of a roller furler. But, the sail was raised, and sailing was done and that counts for something!

In the wind, I had some trouble letting the main sheet out. I couldn't really get it all the way out to run. The lines from the traveller to the boom make contact with the lifelines. That just didn't seem right to me so I keep the mainsail pretty close and only sailed close hauled. See the photo for the setup.

Also, the wind was relatively light today but would gust up to 15 mph. It was a steady wind with a steady current. This just added to my struggles with navigating around the dock. I launch the boat solo from the trailer and it is my least favorite part of boating. It kind of ruins it, to be honest. Docking is an absolute nightmare. I tried filling the ballast and dropping the rudders this time and it didn't' really make it that much more controllable. It seems like the 26M catch a LOT of wind on the broadside and seem very difficult to control at low speeds in comparison to other boats. So I consistently have a really tough time at the dock. Like often it just does not go where I want it to and I'm being pushed along by the wind, whereas other boats are able to more or less stay in the same place.

The primary reason I bought a Macgregor was for trailerability, but I'm really losing patience with public docks. I'm thinking of getting a membership at a private marina so that I can dock in peace, but that will confine me from launching at one spot, which is basically the same as having a fixed keel boat moored in a marina!

Is there a way to make docking easier, or should I just find a private dock and launch in peace?

Congratulations on your first trip under sail. Keep practicing. It will get easier.

The main advantage of the boom furler is to reduce the amount of man sail that is catching the wind. Without the furler you would need to reef the main under the same conditions. The furler gives you gives you all possible reef points for your main; a "normal" setup would give 1, 2, or 3 at fixed points. It's not something that you will be constantly tweaking while sailing. Once you have the right amount of main for the wind conditions you will keep it there until the wind changes enough to make it necessary to adjust again. A couple of changes on a day-long sail would be expected.

Make sure that the slot in the main is clean and free of any burrs. Check the sail slugs for rough spots where they may have caught on something. Lifting the back of the boom will decrease the friction on the slugs and help a lot. Don't forget to let the boom come back down after raising the main (there are times you would keep it raised a bit but that's another lesson).

The slugs should be feeding straight up the slot when you are raising the main. If they are binding in the vertical plane check the height of the boom. It may be pulling everything out of line. If they are twisted in the horizontal plane look for a problem in your bolt rope.

I almost always launch solo (even when I have someone with me). One trick that has helped is to tie a long line from one of the bow cleats to the tow vehicle. I have a rack on the top of mine so it is a very convenient spot. Coil the rope so that it can feed out without catching on anything. Set up your dock lines where they can be easily reached. Back the trailer up until the boat just begins to float and then stop quickly. The boat will slowly float off the trailer and gentlystop at the end of the rope. I usually walk the line over the dock where I attach the dock lines. Sometimes I leave it attached to the tow vehicle if the boat looks like it will stay up against the dock until I can get there.

Like NiceAft said, the windage and difficulty docking are the price we pay for the headroom in the cabin. Engineering is all about choices and compromises; naval engineering even more so. You will get better at it and some days you might even look like you know what you are doing but even after 12 years with this boat I still have embarrassingly bad days for no discernible reason.

Looking at your second picture you appear to have forgotten to fill your ballast tank. That is way too much heel for the apparent wind based on the wave heights.

[NiceAft]

Jimmy said:

Looked at your first photo more closely. Looks like you are connected straight to your topping lift eye. That may be good for raising and lowering, but you need to get the topping lift slightly slack under sail. Your sail shape won't be good with the topping lift holding the boom up.

When the main is fully raised, I just let the topping lift go free; it's not needed anymore.

[Jimmyt]

I found a long thread about docking on here. Backwards seems to be the way to go. Kind of unnerving because the rudders are right there ready to get mashed. I'll practice near a buoy and see how that goes.

You are correct. If you have depth, the rudders can be down, giving better steerage and less chance of hitting them. If not, the rudders have to be up, and you have to be very careful not to back them into anything - as they stick WAY out. Practicing near a buoy seems like a good idea.

You will get much more comfortable with it as your experience increases.

[Jimmyt]

The primary reason I bought a Macgregor was for trailerability, but I'm really losing patience with public docks. I'm thinking of getting a membership at a private marina so that I can dock in peace, but that will confine me from launching at one spot, which is basically the same as having a fixed keel boat moored in a marina!

The more convenient your boat is to use, the more you will use it. You didn't really state your issue with public docks, but I assume overcrowding issues. I have 3 ramps within 14 miles, none of which are crowded on weekdays. However, 2 of the three get very busy on nice weekends and holidays. Since I'm retired, I just do most of my boating during the week. If it really bothers you, get a spot at a marina; either a slip or a trailer parking spot on the hard. This stuff is supposed to be fun and relaxing. If something is taking away the fun and/or relaxation, you need to nip it...

The guys who have their boats slipped do go more often than I do. If I can't go for at least 4 hours, it's not worth the hassle.

You won't be tethered to your marina (unless you sell your trailer). It might make you lazy about pulling it somewhere else, but you can still trailer it if you want.

You'll come up with a scheme that works for you. Give it time.

[Jimmyt]

Check the sail slugs for rough spots...

No sail slugs on this system. Bolt rope is fed into slot.

Looking at your second picture you appear to have forgotten to fill your ballast tank. That is way too much heel for the apparent wind based on the wave heights.

.

[Highlander]

Check the sail slugs for rough spots...

No sail slugs on this system. Bolt rope is fed into slot.

Looking at your second picture you appear to have forgotten to fill your ballast tank. That is way too much heel for the apparent wind based on the wave heights.

.

Nice to see some of our old timers helping the guy out keep up the good work , #1 as I don't consider myself an old timer I just figured I was,nt qualified enough to answer #2 as I,m not a fan of that system he doe,s not need any neg comments ! #3 his best advise will b from guy,s who actually have that system & use it Good work Jimmyt

Now I did see two Mac25,s online yrs ago one had a rotating Boom with the mainsheet attached to the end of the boom & to raise or lower the mainsail the boom vang had to b disconnected from the boom if one was used I thought that was a MacGregor factory design !
The other was an inboom furling system some guy DIY made was a very simple design but required some fabrication skills that one I liked & both used a non modified mainsail I,m sure of ! , these were non cumbersome systems
kicking my butt now that I never d/l & saved them ,but may still b on the net unless the oldtimers r no longer around
J

[Jimmyt]

#2 as I,m not a fan of that system he doe,s not need any neg comments !

The other was an inboom furling system some guy DIY made was a very simple design but required some fabrication skills that one I liked & both used a non modified mainsail I,m sure of ! , these were non cumbersome systems
kicking my butt now that I never d/l & saved them ,but may still b on the net unless the oldtimers r no longer around
J

Nothing wrong with negative comments made constructively.

I have one, and I'm not sure I'm a fan either. I really like the concept, though. That may be the only thing keeping mine out of the scrap pile. Well, I like the ease of setup and takedown, also. But, it's been on thin ice since I bought the boat.

I wish you had the info on other systems, too. I'm looking for ideas, on the off chance that I get around to making some major revisions.

My issues are: bolt rope feeding, sail shape - due to use of standard sail with revised boom, and no outhaul adjustment. I'm making incremental headway, but not there yet. Currently contemplating having the sail modified to fit the application better.

[returnofthemac]

Looking at your second picture you appear to have forgotten to fill your ballast tank. That is way too much heel for the apparent wind based on the wave heights.

I'm going to hypothesize that this had more to do with trim than ballast.

The previous owner rigged up an easy way to tell if the ballast was full. When the ballast valve is open, the light will stay on until the tank is full. Any overflow goes into the bilge. All of his other mods seem to work just fine, so I will assume the ballast was full!

There were a few gusts that took to boat to about 30 degrees and on one's own it can be a bit scary but when it's expected it's fun.

The captain who taught me how to sail called the clinometer the 'fun-o-meter'.

[OverEasy]

As Be Free said it’s all about the choices and compromises unique to your needs….

The types of marinas and facilities varies by the facility.
Some being slip only, some having slips/ramps/boat hoists/trailer storage/parking/fuel/shore power/fresh water hose/restaurant/pub/picnic area/grills/lounge/kitchen/ships store/maintenance/sanitary dump station &/or pump-out and everything in between.

We did our own cost vs. benefits analysis and a marina slip with shore power and fresh water hose worked for us.
We used a marina for the South Carolina estuaries doing day trips and then going home at night.
We made sure we used our boat 3 to 4 days a week for 3 months while there.
We then went up to Lake Champlain (for 70 nights) living aboard using the marinas up there as out nightly berth.
Our high utilization rate helped make the financial aspect viable. (No point in having something and then not using it.)
For us it worked out very nicely.

We found that the transit/prep/launch/retrieve/de-prep/transit wasn’t very conducive for us to enjoy our vessel, (especially when having to factor in tidal cycles).

The distance from home (or work if you desire a quick ‘after’ work foray onto the water) was also a consideration too in our analysis.

Each individual’s situation is unique so there is no one best answer.
You’ll have to see what will work for your situation.

Best Regards
Over Easy