New engine

[Lucky Drifter]

Hi Mac owners we have to replace our 2002 df50 suzuki on our 26x. We are thinking of one of these new light weight 30hp four strokes suzuki or tohatsu. We mainly sail so taking 30 to 40 kilos of extra weight off the stern sounds good for us. Has anyone had experience with a 30hp on a 26x. Any advice greatly appreciated.

[Jimmyt]

Just curious. Why a 30 hp? If you aren't interested in planing, why not go with something in the 9.9 to 20 hp range? What does the 30hp do for you? Generator size, electric start, remote controls, or is there a good price point at 30?

I would think 10-15 hp would put you in the typical sailboat performance range (hull speed motoring). A 20hp would likely give you a bit of cushion.

I'll be interested to see if anyone has done it. Only discussions I remember involved going the other way (70-115hp). I get your idea, though. I didn't get on a plane the last two times I went out (sea state was too rough for anything over hull speed).

[Lucky Drifter]

Thanks Jimmyt
The 30hp is a lot lighter than a 50hp but still has elecric start power tilt & trim & a good alternator, we also usually just motor at hull speed. I just want to be sure that we can push into strong winds with the 30hp. We are also having big supply issues on here on the east coast with a 6 month waiting list & prices have increased 50% in 12 months. If I could get a 50 at good price I would probably stay as per MacGregor's design. I am also looking into importing as we originally did for our 26X.
Regards Lucky Drifters

[Jimmyt]

The 30 hp would be plenty around here to motor into wind and current we typically run into. If you get into 7 knot currents, could be a different thing. Ditto normal wind conditions. Things will have to get pretty rowdy to overwhelm a 30hp on a Mac 26X or M.

[Russ]

It sounds like the 30 would meet your needs.

However, I always think of resale. Would that harm the resale value of a buyer wanting the full Mac motorsailer experience?

[Starscream]

Hi Mac owners we have to replace our 2002 df50 suzuki on our 26x. We are thinking of one of these new light weight 30hp four strokes suzuki or tohatsu. We mainly sail so taking 30 to 40 kilos of extra weight off the stern sounds good for us. Has anyone had experience with a 30hp on a 26x. Any advice greatly appreciated.

I'm not sure I like the idea of a 30HP. An X will either plane or run at hull speed. 30HP isn't enough to plane, so that leaves hull speed. You should probably buy the largest motor that gets you to hull speed in any condition you will be out in. My 2.3HP kicker won't get to hull speed, but it gets close in calm conditions. For a 26 foot sailboat, a 15HP is usually enough, for all but the worst conditions, but why would you be out in a 26 footer in the worst conditions?

So if a 15HP does hull speed, and a 30HP does hull speed, what advantage does the 30 actually give, for its extra cost and weight. You have to evaluate if it's worth it for your situation, but if I was to downsize below 50HP, I don't see any reason for a 20, 25 or 30 or 40. A 15 will get you home at the same speed, and there are a kabillion 26 footers out there running 15's or less. Just my $0.02.

[pitchpolehobie]

I have a 25HP that came with from PO. 26x . I also tend to mostly sail. Agree w above comments. My 25 gets it done but I do wish I had the additional flexibility of a planing engine. My 25 will not plane and I believe a 30 is the same. 9knots w empty ballast. About 7.5 full ballast on flat water. The big 50hp engine gives you incredible flexibility and safety margin. Your use case may be very different, but If you can wait and want a 50plus ID try to wait IMHO. The weight savings on the back of the boat is equivalent to 1 less small person in the cockpit. Reading your other posts ID try to get a good import mechanic to diagnose your 50 and see if fixable.

[Lucky Drifter]

Thanks everyone for your imput. The MacGregor brains trust is always a great help. We have a 6 to 8 month wait for a 50hp & the cost has increased 50% in 12 months. Looks like I have some thinking to do. We are even considering importing like we did for our 26X.
Cheers Len

[Russ]

What is wrong with your current motor?

It might be cheaper to rebuild it than to buy a new one.

[Lucky Drifter]

Hi Russ we are getting a little bit of water into the crankcase oil giving a honey colour, dreaded corrorsion, the df50 is twenty years old so maybe its time.

[Russ]

Yea...water in the oil is usually a really bad thing. I'm not sure all that causes it, but mechanics always make that face when they see it.

Geeze....I hope you can sort out a good solution.

[Highlander]

If u r running in salt or brackish water u should b flushing ur engine with saltaway on occasion


J

[OverEasy]

Just a thought…..

Water in oil maybe not as serious an issue as you may believe… it depends on the rate of water ingress …
The cooling circuit is relatively simple….

A couple quick questions:
Q1 - When was the last time you replaced the water pump impeller?
Q2 - Do you have any external upper power head unit water leaks?
Q3 - Are you consuming oil ( needing to add oil? ) such as smoky exhaust at idle or at power?
Q4 - Are you leaving an oil slick behind your engine on an operational basis?

Why these particular questions you ask.
For Q1 —- if it’s been over a year or so the impeller may have worn AND the shaft seal may have worn out (especially if that shaft seal has never been replaced. It should be accessible when the lower unit is removed…check you service manual for your particular engine first though. This could be a relatively low cost thing to check out before getting too excited. The higher water pressure coming from the water pump impeller is gonna be higher than the static oil pressure on this seal so it’s possible that this could be your culprit.
For Q2 —- The head gasket is the next possible water migration into the oil at the oil return side of things. Head gaskets can get eaten away over time or minor distortion can open up a small weeping channel allowing the head cooling water to seep into the oil. Sometimes the distortion is such that water can also leak externally at the head gasket region. While replacing it (the head gasket) is a bit more involved it is less than a new engine. If your otherwise happy with the power/performance of the engine this may be all you need. Most of the time the engine does not need to be overhauled and should be avoided if possible.
For Q3&4 - This is where the head gasket has failed where some oil may by migrating into the piston cylinder and getting consumed while some other area is letting water migrate into the oil. There may be more distortion in that case or maybe just more erosion of the head gasket. Again, it may be a relatively simple head gasket replacement. If as in Q4 there is oil leaking out of the engine in may also be allowing water in…. This would be rare but it has happened occasionally with a cracked housing near/below the waterline.

The aspect of expectations is something only you can address…. I’d suggest looking at what you want to do and for how long do you want to do it… if there is not a lager volume increase of the oil quantity and you are only out occasional weekends and the engine is for marina or dock use with only occasional longer operations then more frequent oil and filter changes might be an appropriate tactic that could still give you years of acceptable engine usage (saving you the cost of a new engine)… It also depends on what you expect to do with you old engine… there is not much value in a 20 year old engine (especially with a reason for removal issue… ). That doesn’t mean it’s worthless but only to have reasonable residual value expectations.

Now mind you one does not need to be a purest when it comes to an outboard engine. Milky oil isn’t great but it doesn’t mean it’s the end of the world as it were.

Nothing wrong with a new engine either!
A 30 hp can get you a long way at a reasonable consistent speed (which is the same or better than with wind power except you don’t have to tack back and forth) and saves a few kilos of weight.

For our extended Atlantic Intra Costal Waterway (ICW) cruising plans we chose to replace our old persnickety 2-stroke Tohatsu 50hp with a new 60hp 4-stroke Suzuki. For much of the ICW it is channels and rivers (that are not entirely conducive to sail power ). There is going to be a lot of motoring and the “pop-up” Southern afternoon thunderstorms will have us inevitably have us trying to move out of the way or into safe harbor. So for us the new engine purchase was a reasonable move. (The 3 to 4 fold increase (or more) in fuel efficiency is a big bonus as well.)

Your boat, Your rules (and comfort level)!

Hope this helps some.

Best Regards
Over Easy

[Dougiestyle]

Could be the thermostat stuck open and then the motor will build up excessive condensation. is there a crankcase vent valve? maybe plugged? lot of good suggestions so far on this thread alone.

[Lucky Drifter]

Thanks for all your thoughts on our old DF50. There is no water above the crankcase & we have had corrosion in the salt water cooling passages. We cleared that up with Saltaway a few years back. We change impellers regularly but the seal is a good thing to check. We were just going to try to keep running the engine running for a while as it has not done many hours of work but now it will not turn over, it may just be a neutral position switch but I am even having trouble getting a mechanic to have a look at the old girl.