Discouraged Going Up Wind, Close hauled, Cannot Point

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:23 pm

My contribution

http://macgregorsailors.com/phpBB/viewt ... hlight=101

On Edit: (Copy paste from prev post)

More important than the chicken or the egg is what task you expect each to do.

forestay controls mast rake

Lowers control lower mast lee sag and to a degree lee bend, (if thats an accurate term) They are different.

Uppers control upper mast lee sag and contribute to Mid to lower mast bend (fore/ aft) and they control forestay tension.

Back stay contributes to mid to upper mast bend (fore /aft) and helps control forestay sag.

RandyMoon · Post by **RandyMoon** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 3:55 pm

Scott, where did you get your angle meter? That looks like a handy tool.

baldbaby2000 · Post by **baldbaby2000** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 4:07 pm

All this brings up something I've been wondering about. What it the best tension for the lower shrouds. It's always been said that they should be tight like the outers but is this really true. I was in a 7 class race and there were a bunch of Sonars in another class. Every one of them had their lower shrouds loose. That's the way they sailed best. Granted the Sonar is quite different from the M but it makes me wonder about the best tension for the M shrouds.

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 4:27 pm

Scott, where did you get your angle meter? That looks like a handy tool.

Any mechanics tool store sells them. We have a place in KC called clark tool. Dont do the cummins or harbour freight, I dont think of them as "tool stores" just discount outlets.

As for the lowers being loose, everything Ive read says the same. "Uppers tight, lowers just tight but not loose.

Quote from previous post

Googled the heck out of this and Duanne is for the most part correct, The sequence can be done in the order I described however the tensioning is incorrect. Apparently you should tension your uppers and set your lowers to zero or slightly above. The primary purpose of the lowers is to prevent "Lee sag" in the lower half of the mast. Upper shroud tension controls forestay sag and mast tip leeward sag. (news to me) Ive always thought a rigid stick was the best way to sail. Hmmm

Divecoz · Post by **Divecoz** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 7:18 pm

RandyMoon wrote:Scott, where did you get your angle meter? That looks like a handy tool.

Randy and other's . We use this type of "Angle Finder " often at work as I spend a lot of time bending 1" to 4" Conduit. EMT IMC and Rigid.
Big Bucks, Compound bends, no room for error.
Don't go cheap , its not worth it. I buy mine from SEARS and they are good. Starrett just by the name might be better . Mine was under $20 and no doubt Starrett is in, or around there as well. Discount houses sell mostly junk (well at least their Angle Finders are )

theroche · Post by **theroche** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 4:53 pm

I used my digital level on my mast while in my dock. The meter read 98 degrees. My new Loos gage arrived a couple of weeks ago but I have not used it yet. Going to take her out for a motor change and bottom paint. I'll take pictures and post them as work proceeds.
mike

Frank C · Post by **Frank C** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 5:42 pm

theroche wrote:I used my digital level on my mast while in my dock. The meter read 98 degrees.

You sure about that! ... ???

I believe it must read 88 degrees, instead??

Two degrees aft is right in the sweet spot for winds 15+.

eric3a · Post by **eric3a** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 9:17 pm

Frank C · Post by **Frank C** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 2:20 am

REally?? My digital level is stowed right next to my sextant and sliderule ...
in the same box with with the owner guide for GPS plotter~!

Besides, as in reporting a heading, it's easier to relate mast rake in "degrees" than "halyard inches aft!"

(more "nautical sounding" too, especially important on Macgregors!)

eric3a · Post by **eric3a** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:17 am

Radonic · Post by **Radonic** » Tue Jun 12, 2007 8:25 pm

I'm the guy who started this thread, and if you have read a couple of my e-mails describing my Mac, you'll notice its fully loaded and I paid about $60,000 Canadian with all the upgrades. Including the IDA high performance Dagger Board and Larger Rudders.

The boat was a Brand New 2005 Blue Hull Mac. ... I am looking at a new 37-40 foot Jeanneau or the like racer/cruiser.
-- Ed

!	Frank C:
	ModEdits: - To remove email address ... can be entered in the Member Profile. - To remove sale info ... offers to sell a boat belong in the Classified Ads.

Highlander · Post by **Highlander** » Wed Jun 13, 2007 12:32 am

I wont take this subject much futher

Edit:
I'm really trying to restrain myself here

aya16 · Post by **aya16** » Thu Jun 14, 2007 12:37 am

went out today or yesterday in my mac, had the greatest time. sailed very many miles (15) was by myself, pup aboard, An felt every dime I spent on the mac was worth every penny it took to make the dime.

any one looking for a race boat or a major live aboard need not apply.
This boat is a high bred sailboat that does weekends and fun sailing. and with a little more hp will give you a longer weekend.

no one should buy this boat that has 60 thousand dollars and wants a race sailboat or even one that you can live on. If thats what you are looking for 60 grand will get you a nice used scow to play on. then you can have bragging rights about those crappy Macs that just keep getting in the way.
and ask yourself why the hull do they have those smiles on their face.
when they know they have an inferior craft.

I dont know maybe this tread rubs me the wrong way, I went sailing today
had a real nice ride, felt alive and free, had a very nice day. and I did it on my mac. So for what its worth to those that want something more than what I got today the mac just aint for you.

By the way when I was sailing yesterday if someone offered me 60 thousand to get off my boat and let them have it at the time I would have turned them down. But now im home if someone wants to give me 60 thousand Ill take it. But ill just go buy another mac. This time with an eteck 90.

Radonic · Post by **Radonic** » Thu Jun 14, 2007 8:11 pm

Hey, I am sorry, i did not mean or intend to offend any users of this board. ... I am also sorry for posting the message on this baord, did not realize, there was a special area for such ads.

!	Frank C:
	No problem ... now you know.

If I did not mention what I was inteding to buy ... I am sure someone would ask, so I mentioned it.

2 weeks ago, I entered the Susan Hood race on Lake Ontario with my Mac, its a 70 knot race around the lake. It was a point to point to point race, in a triangle about 22 knots in each leg. I thouhgt I would at least complete. Most boats will complete the race in 20-24 hours.

Unfortunetly, there was 0-3 knots of wind during the whole period. out of 50 boats, 1/2 ended up bailing out. I had to bail after 3 hours, since the boat was going no where fast.

The next day I was suprised to see 25 boats finish with no wind with max wind of 3 knots. One boat completed 16 hours. Sailing mostly on its own aparent wind. Many boats are able to speed faster than the wind speed.

Anyways, I really enjoy racing, long distance races, off shore racing, and want to get into ocean racing eventually, and plan to take off to the caribbean for a 4-6 month cruise with my wife and kids. So I have decided to move up to something more suitable for what I want to do ...

MacGregorSailors.com

MacGregorSailors.com

Discouraged Going Up Wind, Close hauled, Cannot Point

Angle of the dangle

Ed Radonic's Macgregor for sale this Fall....

My e-mail about selling my Mac