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Permanent and running BS on fractional boats are very common. Without getting into the rotating mast and the loading of individual side stays, if I or anyone else wanted to add one what is it to anyone else. Why would it have to be braided cable, why not Dyneema, hull why not yellow braided nylon? If it doesn't do anything then why should anyone else care?

Yes they are but for a specific purpose e.g. a backstay to support a full height spinnaker or runners to support an inner staysail or storm jib. Or in the case of non B&R rigs to create the fourth angle of support.

You are correct it is nothing to with anyone else if you do or not do this but this forum is used by lots of inexperienced sailors and to leave them with the impression that simply installing a backstay on the standard rig will allow them to run downwind with more sail than prudent in strong winds is dangerous. It does not do anything to save the rig but it can cause over confidence in an inexperienced sailor or worse apply additional stresses by tensioning the top part of the unsupported mast.

Dyneema would be good any non stretch line would be good, nylon not so good as it can stretch leading to pumping of the mast.

The point which was trying to made is unless you have modified the rig to carry additional sails a backstay is not required and does nothing to protect or save the rig which is what the post was about. Backstays have a place but the inexperienced sailor should learn what they are used for and learn how a B&R rig is designed not just assume that by adding one they have somehow strengthened the rig, because if not used correctly the opposite is true.

Just cause they don't have one like most other rigs don't mean they need one.

If you want to talk to a guy who has actual experience on this issue I would recommend consulting Highlander. I don't think anyone has more sail on the front of his boat than him.
He probably would have interesting comments regarding this issue.

BOAT wrote:If you want to talk to a guy who has actual experience on this issue I would recommend consulting Highlander. I don't think anyone has more sail on the front of his boat than him.
He probably would have interesting comments regarding this issue.

Yep that is one amazing non-standard rig there

If u r considering it for betting pointing yes it will improve sailing tight with some mast bend, for running leave it just snug to help for them sudden gustes & peace of mind ,

I have a masthead rig with double spreaders & three sets of shrouds the 3rd set go all the way to the masthead through both spreaders , I have three forestays genny runs from about 18-20" from masthead to 3ft out on my bowsprit , jib runs from bow to top spreaders , storm jib runs from front of bow hatch to bottom spreaders mast hound,staysil flies off end of bowsprit to masthead I have the caplebity to run up to 5 forestays, 4ft bowsprit is anchored to a double anchor bow roller that is attached by a V bow brkt & a V horn brkt on the nose & cross deck support also & bobstay, spinnaker & drifter run from 4ft off the bowsprit to masthead on their own spinnaker furlers , unfinished mod will also let me fly my cruising spin off a 6ft pole attached to the end of my 4ft bowsprit 10ft out in front of the bow with 3ft midship outriggers
http://i844.photobucket.com/albums/ab1/ ... 010097.jpg
My back stay is mounted to the masthead via a swivel brkt to a traveler mounted on my rear arch
http://i844.photobucket.com/albums/ab1/ ... 010006.jpg
Heres the rig in action from a bowsprit view
http://s844.photobucket.com/user/TheHig ... 3.mp4.html

http://s844.photobucket.com/user/TheHig ... 4.mp4.html

Hope this helps u out J

Yeah, I don't plan on getting a back stay but If I ever was going to run a back stay this is the way i would do it:

BOAT wrote:Well, I must admit - it would make a nice place to hang the boom instead of using that stupid topping lift that bangs around all day while sailing.
(It makes a fine place to fly flags too!)

Hey Boat,
Yea it works real good, right up until that day you raise the main in moderate to heavy breezes, but forgot to un-clip the boom. Then you come off the wind and while your suddenly sailing sideways and wondering why the mainsheet isn't working and you can't spill wind off the main....... and why the heck won't the boom move off the centerline
Then you look up and see the boom end still clipped to the backstay. And at this point it ain't easy to get her to stand back up and get her head up to take the load off the main so you can un-clip it.
I admit it..... I've made some pretty dumb mistakes. Did this with my Catalina 22. I laid her over so hard that the swing keel swung back up into the trunk with a bang (500 pound keel). Luckily it swung back out again.
The first thing I did when I got home was get rid of that pigtail. And I've thrown every one away on every boat since.

You can keep that boom clip thingy, I'll take a topping lift any day over that boobytrap. Of course, this could have been a case of operator error and not the boom clip's fault..... maybe

Not knocking you or anything..... just thought my boom pigtail experience would be a good cautionary tale. If you use one, just don't forget to un-hook the boom before raising the main in stiff breezes.

Best Breezes,
Steve K.

A topping lift does more than hold the boom
It can be used to increase the belly in the main

Allan