Any news on the Tattoo 22?

[John McDonough]

Their website says it will be available in 2014. The 100 day countdown has started...

Well its almost 2015 and I know nothing more than I knew last year at this time.
Its been about a year since I checked this site. I see most of the same people are still here.

Retired now. The 22 seems so simple to set-up and get sailing again. last time I sailed was in Oct 2009.

[BOAT]

I got grief on this site when I told all of you that there was no way they could bring this boat to production based on what they were publishing. Just not enough details in the drawings and too many parts of the drawings they did have just did not "fit" with the reality of dimensions needed to fit things like pop top head room and a motor well and the galley appliances - it was clear all this was just not worked out. It was obvious that they were still in the design phase. Until you see some really decent line drawings that actually show the location of required stuff like ballast tanks, batteries, chain plates, centerboard well, and etc with some hard numbers on the specs you had better accept that this boat is still in the design phase and there has been no fabrication activity yet.

Then when they actually do get to fabrication expect another zillion things that need to get done that they were not even aware of. That will take a while to sort out also. I will bet ten bucks they end up with a hybrid construction of part fiberglass and part epoxy instead of an ALL epoxy boat. The labor expense just does not pencil out for a boat so small unless they invent a new way to finish epoxy, (who knows?)

I think some are learning the reasons behind Rogers philosophy of building only ONE boat at a time and putting all design and manufacturing resources into only ONE boat.

I'm sure the 22 will be there in about 10 years when I'm too old to handle the 26 and I will be looking for something smaller to tow and launch and I will probably have a smaller home and a downsized driveway. We are all getting older.

For the sake of those who are older than me and are already retiring and in need of a smaller, lighter, easier to handle boat I hope Tattoo can get to fabricating something sooner. I'm sure they will - but give it at least another year.

[RobertB]

In ten years I will want something smaller? Yeah, I am already finding the 26 kind of cramped and tight to maneuver in. Definitely want a 22 that is smaller and more cramped
Now, if it were wide as a catboat (1/2 as wide as long) then I could start to consider.

[seahouse]

Agree - the universal rule - it always takes much longer than you think it will.

I've been involved with the development of new products, and the hardest thing to resist sometimes is the urge to put something on the market before it is ready (to get generating some revenue, usually). Electronic products are bad for that with their short cycle time to obsolescence - has there ever been a cell phone put on the market that didn't have glitches (if you look closely enough) when it was first put on the market? Or computer operating system?

While you can go on perfecting something forever if you're not careful, I suspect that there is caution being used here to make sure it's "ready" for the market. To the company's credit.

-B.

…on edit… oops, meaning I was agreeing above with BOAT regarding time-to-market issue, Robert's post snuck in ahead of mine...

[BOAT]

You guys all have some kind of mental impediment about what kind of boat we are talking about on this blog - we are not talking about fixed keel boats and catamarans like all the other boats in the marina tied to a dock.

ON A TRAILER - you guys all forget that we are talking about a TRAILERABLE BOAT! That's what MacGregor (tattoo) makes.

When your old and are too weak to hoist a mast and hitch a trailer and launch and all the other stuff then sure - we would all love to just go to the slip and walk right on to a big boat and untie the lines and go - BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT MACGREGOR MAKES OR SELLS! I got at TRAILERABLE boat because THAT'S WHAT I WANTED! If I didn't, I would have bought something else! So when I am old and still want a TRAILERABLE boat I think smaller and lighter just might be a good idea so I mention it here on THIS site where TRAILERABLE boats are the subject, right?

Pull your head out of the yacht club - we are never going to be there on this site so face the facts that we are all in a TRAILERABLE BOAT and that's not the same as all those other boats that some people seem to really wish they were sailing instead of a MAC based on some of the comments I hear on this blog. If you want to compare the MAC with another boat that is TRAILERABLE and you think it's a better boat than the Mac, THEN BUY IT! So far I have not found a bigger OR better boat that is TRAILERABLE. Please enlighten me if I'm wrong.

In the meantime those of us who know we are never going to slip our boats and are accepting the fact that sooner or later we are going to get old and weak are looking forward to a boat that is smaller and lighter and easy to TRAILER and launch. Make sense?

[RobertB]

Boat - your Caps lock key keeps sticking

Oh, and I think I realize I have a trailerable boat - kind of hard to sail overland 20 miles to my driveway - But would be so cool if I could.

[BOAT]

Well how big do you think we should go on a TRAILERABLE boat? (Emphasis mine).

I just want to make sure we are clear on what we are talking about - are you really looking for a bigger boat ON A TRAILER? Or are you just talking about a bigger boat?

If your talking about on a trailer, well then just how big do you want to go?? I mean - what is even possible at this point? You really want to trailer a 40 foot boat?? I'm just not sure where your going with the whole thing of Tattoo making a trailer boat that is even bigger than the 26.

It just seems logical to me that if Tattoo is going to make a second boat at all that it would have to be smaller unless they were getting out of the trailerable boat business. And if they did, the competition would kill them. They could not make a keel boat comparable to what's already available in ANY size, so I'm just not clear on what you expect Tattoo to manufacture? Maybe I'm missing the point of a bigger boat.

[dlandersson]

LOL...and me with my 2 foot-itis.

In ten years I will want something smaller? Yeah, I am already finding the 26 kind of cramped and tight to maneuver in. Definitely want a 22 that is smaller and more cramped
Now, if it were wide as a catboat (1/2 as wide as long) then I could start to consider.

[BOAT]

I dunno, maybe I'm all wet - maybe a bigger boat WOULD be better. I guess it just never crossed my mind to put more boat on the trailer.

I suppose if anyone could figure out how to do it the MacGregors could - the 26M is already kicking my butt when I'm all alone - setting up the mast and stuff, launching, docking and so forth by myself, sailing around, then docking and then back on the trailer and then facing the de-rigging at the end of the day before driving home. I did not even liked it when I was a kid, but despite that I still preferred the trailer boat over anything else. I well understand that on a 45 foot Ericson or Hunter you just back out of the slip and go but I don't have a slip so I'm not looking forward to more boat when I get old.

Gee, I wish I started doing all this stuff when I was younger.

Anyways, I completely understand all you guys out there that want a big boat - it makes sense - but I just don't think you should expect it to come from Tattoo - but who knows I might be all wrong and Tattoo might introduce the Tattoo 42 this winter.

So in response to the "2-foot-itis" that seems to be SO common amongst everyone here what is the best size for a new boat in your opinion? 28 feet? Longer? I hate 36 foot boats, they are just big enough to almost be a luxury yacht and too small to really have any luxury inside. I would be very frustrated with something like that. Still, if we are gonna go bigger, what size are you guys thinking of?

[Wind Chime]

My 2 cents –

For Roger’s Mac’s and now for Tattoo, I think it’s about economy of scale. The 26 footers are a relatively low-cost production boat that gets the highest rate of return from an entry level customer. They are not a high-end yacht like the three or four per year 60 footers Roger is now making himself in the old factory in Southern Cal. Remember that part of the reason Roger discontinued production of the M (besides retiring) is due to the increased California environmental regs that reduced his output all the way down to a limit of one per day (I believe), and that does not make money unless the price per unit is much higher.

Part of the business model has also been the logistics of distributing via container shipping. You can put a 40 foot long boat in a 40 foot long container, but it’s still only gonna be 8 feet wide and 8 feet high. And a Mac or a Tat is already a skinny bullet at 26’x8’. And oh ya, about the legal width to trailer without a permit … generally about 8 feet I think. Although annual oversize permits are faily easy and inexpensive, it’s just another hurdle for the customer to bear when making a purchase decision in a competitive market.

[dlandersson]

While I'd like a 30ish foot boat (32RK is my current goal), I think Roger M found that the "sweet spot" is the Mac 26x/26M - just small enough to be street legal, but still have a head. It is the largest boat for its size - and the fact that it "just fits" within the no permit needed Fed size is a strong selling point. Any boat dealer at some point needs to stay in business, so I don't see any major changes in the Tattoo series.

[BOAT]

That probably explains a lot of my misunderstanding about this blog - I guess I need to realize that many here are only in a MAC because they could not get the boat they really wanted and are only temporary until they can reach their goal boat.

It was silly of me to think that everyone would be like me. I always wanted the MAC and that's the only boat I want - even if I can afford a bigger boat, I still refuse to give up the ability to take the boat with me on the road because of the way I like to travel.

It was wrong for me to think everyone else would feel the same way. That was sort of dumb on my part.

[dlandersson]

Buzzz....and thank you for playing.

A 32RK is my hypothetical goal for my 2nd boat. A 32RK is $150,000 (used $100,000), is a sailboat and does not have the tubing, wakeboarding (not gonna worry about waterskiing) capabilities of the 26X/M. The Mac 26X/M is much better suited as a general purpose family boat. I can see down the road, I'm going to need to "up" my outboard (as technolgies improve and weight goes down) so that I can do some limited waterskiing, etc.

That probably explains a lot of my misunderstanding about this blog - I guess I need to realize that many here are only in a MAC because they could not get the boat they really wanted and are only temporary until they can reach their goal boat.

It was silly of me to think that everyone would be like me. I always wanted the MAC and that's the only boat I want - even if I can afford a bigger boat, I still refuse to give up the ability to take the boat with me on the road because of the way I like to travel.

It was wrong for me to think everyone else would feel the same way. That was sort of dumb on my part.

[Québec 1]

Am trailering to Florida for the Xmas holidays again this year. 3 rd time. Everyone is confused when I tell them I take my boat to Florida from eastern Canada in 2 days in Winter. I'm Finally doing it with a truck type vehicle cause the old tow beast(Buick le saber)has holes in the floor and required retirement.

I got the 26m cause it can do this.

I can't wait to see the Tattoo 22

[mastreb]

Ran aground in the middle of the bay two weeks ago in the keel boat, and had to be towed off. Have sailed through the same spot a thousand times on the Mac.

Also, getting home when you're tired of sailing takes hours instead of minutes.