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If MacGregor is approving greater than 50HP with the M, my motor of choice would be the 60HP Mercury BigFoot EFI four-stroke. It's the same 264 lb outboard as the 50HP model, both with 2.33:1 gearing, and 14" prop selection. I'd probably opt for the 9" pitch Black Max prop.

We love the one on our Whaler. It's a four cylinder and smooth running. Mercury parts and service are available in many places. It uses the same spark plugs as Evo and Twin Cam Harleys. I wish I'd known how scarce Suzuki support is, at least in Ohio, before we bought this X.

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Moe

Ok I don't think anyone has mentioned it yet, but since this is a pro/con for a bigger motor I have a con. I have a Tohatsu 50 (not TLDI) that can start with a small rope. I had to do this once already (had to replace old batts)- with a storm coming- a wall of rain that I couldn't even see through. I was able to get the motor started by hand quickly and beat the storm. I like the ability to start the motor without electrical power if I need to. I don't know about the 4 strokes. I doubt the 90hp motor can be pull started.

Jeff S

OK Frank I added some extra specs for you:
Mercury 50/60 EFI 4Stroke 1.83:1 995cc 248lbs
Mercury Bigfoot 50/60 2.33:1 995cc 262lbs
Yamaha 50/60 4 stroke 1.85:1 996cc 237lbs
Yamaha 50/60 Highthrust 2.33:1 996cc 242lbs/255lbs
Tohatsu 50 TDLI 1.85:1 697cc 210lbs
Tohatsu 70 TDLI 2.33:1 1267cc 315lbs
Nissan 50 1.85:1 697cc 210lbs
Nissan 70 2.33:1 1267cc 315lbs
Suzuki 40/50 2.27:1 815cc 240lbs
Suzuki 60/70 2.42:1 1298cc 340lbs
Honda 50 2003model 2.09:1 808cc 205lbs
Honda 50 2004/05 2.08:1 808cc 205lbs

Terry,
Please add to your list the top of the Wide Open Throttle RPM range. It matters only a little less than the gear ratio. For example the difference in gear ratio and WOT RPM for the Honda BF50 and Suzuki DF50 cancel each other out, so the two can use the same prop.
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Clear comparisons after this math:
(WOT RPM) / (Gear Ratio) = Prop RPM
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As much as I loved my Suzuki DF50 turning a 12.25" prop, I agree that the outboards that can turn a larger diameter 14"+ prop have a significant advantage. I think the Suzuki 6500/2.27=2863 DF50 has a very big advantage over the 5500/1.8=3055 outboards even with the same diameter prop.
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The faster the prop RPM the greater percentage of power is lost to rotational forces on the water that do not contribute to the boat going where you want it to go this includes steering and speed.
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Having rented a relatively heavy "portable" outboard this summer and used it next to a very light similar power outboard, I definately agree than the heavier motor is much better for quiet and smooth and it seemed on this occation that the heavy motor was easier to start.

Hello,
Even the TLDI 40 cannot be started with a rope, because the ECU that controls fuel injection needs a battery.
Moe, I remember my dealer telling me even the ms were only rated for a 50hp, although they recommended 70 hps. People may want to doublecheck this with their dealers to ensure the hull warranties.
Rolf

According to Bluewater Yachts, The X is only rated for a 50, period, anything else will void the hull warranty. The M is also only rated for 50, except, MacGregor will honor the hull warranty with a 70 IF one of their dealers installed the motor. If you take it to a third party shop for the motor the factory will only warranty the boat with a 50.

A non EFI / Carbed Tohatsu 50 can be hand started. Can any of the 4 strokes or the newer motors be started without a battery? It seems that the all have computerized components. Does this mean they cannot be hand started. What about a 4 stroke Yamaha/Mercury which is not fuel injected but does have a computer. Ditto for the Honda. Can a Suzuki 50 be hand started as it is fully electronic?

My 2000 model non-EFI Merc 50 4-stroke has an electronic ignition module that is computerized and it can be hand started. They even have a little pouch inside the motor hood with the pull starter in it. I presume that is what you meant by non-EFI computerized, seeing as in 2001, they went to EFI so I have the last year of carbs.

Moe wrote:If MacGregor is approving greater than 50HP with the M, my motor of choice would be the 60HP Mercury BigFoot EFI four-stroke. It's the same 264 lb outboard as the 50HP model, both with 2.33:1 gearing, and 14" prop selection. I'd probably opt for the 9" pitch Black Max prop.

We love the one on our Whaler. It's a four cylinder and smooth running. Mercury parts and service are available in many places. It uses the same spark plugs as Evo and Twin Cam Harleys. I wish I'd known how scarce Suzuki support is, at least in Ohio, before we bought this X.

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Moe

I have the carburated version of the Merc 60 4-stroke. In my opinion the motor is too weak. I have never exceeded 20 mph. Usually tops out around 18 mph.

The X should have at least 70 horsepower. If I had it to do again it would be the Suzuki 140 or a Yamaha Jet-drive 85 hp.

I think the key to hand starting is the motor must be carbureted. Also it can't be so large that it is physically impossible to pull the rope. 50 hp is probably the upper limit for most. The fuel injected engines need battery power for the fuel pump to pressurize the injectors before they fire up.

Folks with the older Tohatsus, etc. can get away with one battery bank of one or several batteries wired in parallel because they can hand start if necessary. In the newer fuel injected engines you are essentially forced to have two banks and the combiner, switches or whatever of your choice to insure you always have power to start the engine.

Terry,
I very much respect all of the research and knowledge that Robert brings to the engine choice discussion, and agree with his suggestions. Though I forgot to write of it, the 14" prop was another important criterion during my engine selection.

Regarding pull-starting .... I very much doubt my Suzuki 60 could be pull started, since all EFI motors need a high pressure fuel pump. I also doubt that the benefits of emergency pull-starting can possibly equal the benefits of higher horsepower and performance. I carry a jump-start battery on my boat, and I always have sail power as my get-home backup.

I have the Honda 50 and have hand started it. It's actually fairly easy. I too plan on going much bigger sometime soon. I don't feel the hand starting ability outweighs the versatility and fun of the bigger motors. I have the Link 1000 battery monitor anyway.

This is just a guess, but there might not be enough juice to spin the engine, but enough to run the computer for the EFI. Hand cranking might still work. I know this works with some cars (jumping, not hand pulling).

On the other hand some cars have a sensor that prevents starting below a certain voltage.

some electronic controlled engines are designed to be able to be rope started.

I am not the only one capable of rope starting an envinrude E-tec 75 and 90.. these engines deserve serious consideration

magnetos make this possible to provide enough charge to initiate electronics in less than half a turn of the power head, but it takes a fairly healthy pull

see trailerboat magazine Feb 2004

I haven't tried hand starting my evinrude etec 50, but maybe I should. It came with a pull start rope and the owner's manual gives you instructions for useing the pull starter.

I wouldn't think they'd put the instructions there if it can't be done.

[quote="Chip Hindes"]
The federally mandated maximum horsepower data plate requirement for weight capacity, passengers and HP does not apply to boats over a certain length. I believe the magic number is 22 feet, but in any case it doesn't apply to the Mac, and you will not find such a plate or decal anywhere on the boat. Instead, what we have is a much looser "manufacturer's recommendation." quote]

In Europe, and due I think to the CE marking inside a category (coastal navigation - C in the case of the Mac 26 X & M), there is a plate that comes with the boat, where you have the maximum power the boat can handle. And this corresponds to the 50 Hp. I think this is the reason why the 26M maximum motor in Europe is not 70Hp, but 50 Hp , as then there is no need to go for a re-classification of the boat.

Fair winds,

Miquel
Culzean.