Running lines to Cockpit and other ideas to make sailing easier

[adventuren1]

Here is a better shot with the slugs down. But, as noted by Boat, the position of the slot makes a big difference. On the X model, at least on mine, the slot is just above the boom. The difference in sail positioned when reefed is not that big. If you just use a sail stop above the slot, you are only losing about 7" or 8" of difference. The bigger reason for me to use the Mastgate is that it does help when stowing the sail under the cover. Also, I would mention this worked well for me because I left my boat in the water with the mast up. If you are trailering every day, the sail stop is an OK way to go. For one, if you get to the ramp and it's a reefed sailing kind of day, you might just stick with docktails for the day. But, always be ready to reef on every day out! There are homemade versions of mast gates and you just need to decide which one fits your style of boating. But everything you do to make solo boating easier, also makes it safer. So it's worth the expense and effort.

[pitchpolehobie]

The mast gate is an alternative to a slug stop. A mast gate is a very doable solution to preventing the slugs from coming out when lowering the sail, but a mast gate will have to be open in order to reef, no different than removing the slug stop.

The Mastgate from Tom at mastgate.com solves that problem. It creates an open channel for the slugs to slide all the way down. Once you get it installed, it just stays in and the main can be raised and lowered fully. Tom makes them himself in Vancouver, WA and it takes some measuring and test fitting, but he will make you a part that is custom fit to your boat. The slug openings in the mast of these boats are made by hand, so each mastgate he makes can be a little different.

https://mastgates.com/mast-profiles Do you know which one would work for a 2002 26X w/ stock mast? My boat is covered and about 2.5 hours away currently for the season.

[NiceAft]

The bigger reason for me to use the Mastgate is that it does help when stowing the sail under the cover.

I do not remove the slug stop when lowering the main and wrapping the sail cover around the mast and boom.

In my case (2005 M) the only advantage to a mast gate is it is fixed to the mast. I have lost a stop or two, but not in a very long time. That’s why I keep a spare.

[BOAT]

I have never had a slug stop - why in the world would I ever need a slug stop - what possible purpose would a slug stop do for me?? It's a totally useless device for my set up an I have never used one and never had one.

[NiceAft]

I have never had a slug stop - why in the world would I ever need a slug stop - what possible purpose would a slug stop do for me?? It's a totally useless device for my set up an I have never used one and never had one.

With all due respect BOAT, you have already established that your set up is not representative of the mast on earlier M’s & all X’s. The slug opening on your mast is significantly higher than mine. Your use of the mast gate is not doable with for my M.

So you don’t need to take this personally. It’s not meant that way. This is for those who don’t have what you have. MacGregor obviously made changes that benifit those who have a later model M.

[BOAT]

I must have been confused because I got the impression that I needed a slug stopper to keep the sail in the mast
In one of the posts it said that the mast gate needs to be open in order to reef - That one really got me confused - I was getting the impression that I was not explaining myself when you said the mastgate big advantage was for stowing the sail low on the boom.

All of these features mentioned are doable with no stopper or even the gate opened so I was pretty lost. I guess I still don't get it.

[NiceAft]

The opening on my mast, and it seems on X’s, is just above where the boom meets the mast; very much not like your mast, what you can do, we can’t, not complicated.

[Sheppie62]

So many different set up’s and ways to load the sail, stop the sail from falling out, folding flaking etc. So I’m looking at getting the sliders attached to my original 1998 26x sail (bolt type) I think that what it’s called with a rope sewed in, that slides up mast channel. I see BWYs has these slides and shackles, so do I need to install grommets or have someone sew loops onto the sail? I am going to buy or make a mast gate, I really like idea of sail dropping all the way to the boom. That will make flaking/ folding the sail so much easier and better. When reefing the sail, do the bottom sides stay in the channel? I need to look at more pictures of reefed sails.

[BOAT]

The opening on my mast, and it seems on X’s, is just above where the boom meets the mast; very much not like your mast, what you can do, we can’t, not complicated.

Yeah, I think I finally figured that out - sorry for the confusion - as usual I am slow on the take.

Would it be worth it to grind an opening into the mast higher up? Seems like it would save you guys a lot of headaches.

[NiceAft]

The fact of the matter is that I don’t feel disadvantaged.

The hope is that maybe some board member who see’s this thread will try the advise that you just gave. I’m sure someone is thinking this is right for them. For me, no. It’s just not something that has been a problem. Seventeen years, remember.

[adventuren1]

The mast gate is an alternative to a slug stop. A mast gate is a very doable solution to preventing the slugs from coming out when lowering the sail, but a mast gate will have to be open in order to reef, no different than removing the slug stop.

The Mastgate from Tom at mastgate.com solves that problem. It creates an open channel for the slugs to slide all the way down. Once you get it installed, it just stays in and the main can be raised and lowered fully. Tom makes them himself in Vancouver, WA and it takes some measuring and test fitting, but he will make you a part that is custom fit to your boat. The slug openings in the mast of these boats are made by hand, so each mastgate he makes can be a little different.

https://mastgates.com/mast-profiles Do you know which one would work for a 2002 26X w/ stock mast? My boat is covered and about 2.5 hours away currently for the season.

You need to take a bunch of measurements from your boat and Tom will build it to your boat specifically. This is because the gate opening on each boat is slightly different due to being hand bent. Get a hold of Tom and get the latest on his work. I bought mine 3 years ago.

[adventuren1]

So many different set up’s and ways to load the sail, stop the sail from falling out, folding flaking etc. So I’m looking at getting the sliders attached to my original 1998 26x sail (bolt type) I think that what it’s called with a rope sewed in, that slides up mast channel. I see BWYs has these slides and shackles, so do I need to install grommets or have someone sew loops onto the sail? I am going to buy or make a mast gate, I really like idea of sail dropping all the way to the boom. That will make flaking/ folding the sail so much easier and better. When reefing the sail, do the bottom sides stay in the channel? I need to look at more pictures of reefed sails.

I am rebuilding a mac 21 and considered the idea of adding the grommets and slides to my mainsail. Keep in mind my earlier discussions were about my 26X which already has this set up. So as an example of this issue, on my Mac 21, I chose to buy a new main sail from BWY. It comes with all the stuff you need and new sail to boot! I have not had a new sail before so I am excited to see what it's like on this small boat. I would have really enjoyed a new sail on my 26X! So, what kind of shape is your sail in? Adding grommets is easy with the purchase of a few simple tools. Get a backing material to place at each grommet. Sailrite is another resource for all this. Place them every 2 feet up the sail and get a slide and shackle that fits. I got that advice from the Hasse sail loft in Port Townsend. They would have done the work for me at a couple hours labor. But I went with a new sail for less than $600. So in short, you want the slide set up you pictured. Either by getting a new sail, or converting your existing. The size of the shackle will be best chosen after you install grommets. That determines the depth of the shackle. I don't think any of it is critical. The slide diameter is 3/8" I think, but call BWY and have them set you up. They will be your best friend! My Mac 21 came with a bolt rope main sail and I would not even consider using it for solo boating.

[BOAT]

The fact of the matter is that I don’t feel disadvantaged.

The hope is that maybe some board member who see’s this thread will try the advise that you just gave. I’m sure someone is thinking this is right for them. For me, no. It’s just not something that has been a problem. Seventeen years, remember.

Okay, I did some research on this and even wrote a friend that used to be at the factory and I got some back story on the latest mast gate on the M and also a little history on the mast openings.

First off - I was wrong - Ray was right - the mast slot opening on MOST boats SHOULD BE and is down low near the boom. I was wrong when I said that MY setup may have been a better idea that previous models. So here is the scoop I got:

The reason the sail slot opening needs to be AT THE BOOM is because a REAL SAIL has a BOLT ROPE! - not slugs. I agree - as a previous sail snob I remember saying that a sail with slugs is not a real sail because the bolt rope belongs in the sail slot as designed. When you load a REAL sail with a bolt rope you need the sail on the deck and you load it into the mast at the boom - if the mast gate is too high there will be no support for the tack - thus - mast gate must be AT THE BOOM to properly use a bolted sail.

Any sail snob will remind you that a bolted sail will outperform a slugged sail every time - and they would be right.

Now, that explains why 99% of boats have the mast gate at the boom - and if you use a BOLTED sail like your supposed to there would be no need for a slug stopper!

The only reason you need slug stoppers is for SLUGS! 99% of sailboats were not designed to use slugs! They were designed to use a bolted sail.

So why in the hull do so many late M boats have the mast gate so high up the mast????

Because of Captain Mike Inmon - yup - the mast gate was moved up to accommodate the Mike Inmon roller furling main. The way that the roller furler main worked was with a BOLTED sail that rolled up on the boom. The sail fed into a bolt feeder up there on the mast - (you cant feed it into the lower gate because the furler sits way up high on the boom).

IN FACT! with the gate high up on the mast MY BOAT IS WRONG for a bolted sail because the sail is not properly supported at the tack unless you also load the bottom of the sail into the bottom of the gate so the sail is bolted all the way to the boom.

So, some sail snob I am - I'm sailing a mast that is not even properly set up for a bolted main!! (Oh, the embarrassment!)

So, the only boats that have the high mast gate are the late model M boats that were sold by Mike Inmon from the factory. So not all California boats are like this - only the southern California boats.

I stand corrected and apologies to Ray.

[NiceAft]

No apology needed BOAT, you never said anything you needed to apologize for. If anything, you created a path to knowledge that both of us were not aware of; MacGregor created a different mast near the end of its production line. You started with a perceived fact that your mast was representative of all & masts , and I with the same perceived fact. We met in the middle, enlightened.

Have you ever heard the story of the three blind men who were describing what an elephant must look like.

One was at the tail, and thought long and bony.
One was at a leg, and thought wide and stout.
One was at the trunk, and thought long and flexible.

You had one type of mast, and the rest of the Mac universe had another

[Be Free]

...
Any sail snob will remind you that a bolted sail will outperform a slugged sail every time - and they would be right.
...

They would be right, but could you actually measure the difference in performance between a bolted main and a slugged main on a Mac?

I love my boat and I really enjoy sailing it but I have no delusions that it is in any way remarkable under sail.

Getting back on topic, I would be very interested in a way to secure the tack while reefing without having to leave the cockpit and without having to spend an inordinate amount of time with convoluted lines while setting up and tearing down.