26M Forestay

[magnetic]

Hi

I have searched the Forum for info on preferred configurations for the CDI Furler Forestay on the , and although I can find lots about rig tension, there are two points I'd be grateful for your help on

1. Rigging singlehanded. Is there any easy way of getting sufficient tension into the forestay to allow the clevis pin to be slotted in, or is it fundamentally a two-person job? I had the mast raising system tightened right up AND the main halyard winched tight onto the pulpit, but I still couldn't tug hard enough with one hand to allow the other hand to pop the plug in. The rope loop trick would work fine while the boat is still on the trailer and I can stand off of the pulpit, but on the water it doesn't seem viable.

2. Turnbuckle connector. My forestay turnbuckle has the standard (fairly soft metal) saddle arrangement, which is secured with a clevis pin and a cotter / ring ding. This looks remarkably insubstantial, and I have temporarily replaced the flimsy clevis pin with a double-nutted s/s bolt (keeping the mast raising system and the main halyard connected to the pulpit just in case). Is there a better way? A horesehoe shackle maybe?

I'd be grateful for any guidance, thanks

[Highlander]

Hi Andrew ,
Sorry buddy been busy but I replied to your p/m with some video's hope they help , let me know if you received them OK .I'll be posting some new pic's later this wk of my boat with some finnished mods

Cheers J
PS I would put a non swivel block with a Ronstan rf1055 eyestrap at least 8" - 12" above the furler attached with two SS 3/16 rivets for a spinnaker halyard
Make sure your shroud eye straps at the top of your lower & upper shrouds are not snagged if so they will shorten your shrouds by an inch or two ! and that would be a pita to attach

[ozz]

I have the same set up and same problem. It seems i need a third hand. I tried re adjusting the shrouds, but then they are too loose after the forestay is finally connected.. I will watch here for any other ideas...thanx

[c130king]

1. Rigging singlehanded. Is there any easy way of getting sufficient tension into the forestay to allow the clevis pin to be slotted in, or is it fundamentally a two-person job? I had the mast raising system tightened right up AND the main halyard winched tight onto the pulpit, but I still couldn't tug hard enough with one hand to allow the other hand to pop the plug in. The rope loop trick would work fine while the boat is still on the trailer and I can stand off of the pulpit, but on the water it doesn't seem viable.

I find that I can "over tighten" the mast raising system enough that I can easily slip the pin through to secure the CDI to the forestay mount. Then once it is connected I simply loosen the mast raising system allowing the mast to pull the forestay tight. Same way when disconnecting the CDI...only in reverse.

Just put up my mast completely singlehanded today...no problems at all. And my forestay is fairly tight...at least compared to what it was three years ago before I learned better.

Okay, one small problem...I forgot to install the lines for my lazy jacks and had to reconnect the mast raising system...after completely taking it off the boat...and relower the mast so I could run the lines. But that only set me back about 5-10 minutes max.

Can't help you with the turnbuckle question...I figure if I don't ever think about my turnbuckle then nothing bad could ever possibly happen to it...

Cheers,
Jim
Sailing on König

[Terry]

Hi

I have searched the Forum for info on preferred configurations for the CDI Furler Forestay on the , and although I can find lots about rig tension, there are two points I'd be grateful for your help on

2. Turnbuckle connector. My forestay turnbuckle has the standard (fairly soft metal) saddle arrangement, which is secured with a clevis pin and a cotter / ring ding. This looks remarkably insubstantial, and I have temporarily replaced the flimsy clevis pin with a double-nutted s/s bolt (keeping the mast raising system and the main halyard connected to the pulpit just in case). Is there a better way? A horesehoe shackle maybe?

I'd be grateful for any guidance, thanks

I have a similar problem connecting my turnbuckle to the foretang, it does seem to require a third hand but I always manage to have that third hand available.

As for the unsubstantial oem forestay and turnbuckle, well I really never noticed it until I got my Schaefer CF700 Snapfurl roller furler that required an upgrade to a 5/32 wire, same thickness as the shrouds. When I took the oem forestay to a rigging shop to get a heavier guage wire the guy recommended I just get a completely new forestay that included the next size up 5/16 turnbuckle so I went for it. It is much beefier and stronger than the 1/8 oem turnbuckle and combined with the 5/32 forestay it appears to be much more substantial and puts my doubts aside. My Scaefer unit is also much more robust and substantial than the CDI, so the whole setup is an improvement.
In hindsight I now wonder why the factory would expect a smaller forestay to counter the force of 4 heavier shrouds so I feel much more secure with my stronger setup. When I hold the oem turnbuckle and forestay beside my new replacement there is a substantial difference in size but the larger turnbuckle still fits easily inside the Scheafer drum. After comparing my setup along side some of the CDI setups I clearly favour the Schaefer unit even if it is a bit more expensive, it looks very impressive and gets attention from other Mac owners.

[Phil M]

2. Turnbuckle connector. My forestay turnbuckle has the standard (fairly soft metal) saddle arrangement, which is secured with a clevis pin and a cotter / ring ding. This looks remarkably insubstantial, and I have temporarily replaced the flimsy clevis pin with a double-nutted s/s bolt (keeping the mast raising system and the main halyard connected to the pulpit just in case). Is there a better way? A horesehoe shackle maybe?

I'd be grateful for any guidance, thanks

I too am not impressed with the clevis pin/ring ding combination for holding the forestay/furler. I am thinking a horseshoe shackle may be a better option for my less than nimble fingers, but a ring ding would never come undone, so I guess I will have to suffer with a ring ding.

Phil M

[Catigale]

I haven't done all the vectors but i suspect there is a lot more tension in the upper shrouds than the forestay.

I'm having trouble seeing how a shackle ( horseshoe) will be easily attached to hold the furler. Seems to me to be the same action as pushing a pin, but then you have to thread it under tension

One way to help this issue is to install a quick release lever - see mods

[waternwaves]

to answer your questions.

#1 Is there any easy way of getting sufficient tension into the forestay to allow the clevis pin to be slotted in

The important starting point is to make sure the mast raising pole is not at a 90 degree angle to the mast to start raising. This angle should be about 80 degrees. This will allow the sheaves used in the mast raising process to get close enough to the deck on raising to actually pull the forestay far enough that there is slack for positioning the pin and ringding. Most do not allow enough overtravel to make this process easy.

#2 Is there a better way? A horesehoe shackle maybe?

I don't see how a horseshoe shackle or any shackle is easier to inspect or adjust than a turnbuckle. IF you do truly want even more ease of length adjustment (which should not be done underway) an adjustable backstay is a better bet for performance improvement, and could incorporate a mast raising slack position, and a range of running positions.

[Catigale]

Turnbuckle connector. My forestay turnbuckle has the standard (fairly soft metal) saddle arrangement, which is secured with a clevis pin and a cotter / ring ding. This looks remarkably insubstantial, and I have temporarily replaced the flimsy clevis pin with a double-nutted s/s bolt (keeping the mast raising system and the main halyard connected to the pulpit just in case). Is there a better way? A horesehoe shackle maybe?

Just re-reading. A nut/bolt of the same OD is weaker than a clevis pin, of course. The threads remove material and of course this lowers strength. The nuts dont contribute to the resistance to shear, they just make sure it doesnt slip out.

Everyone with a turnbuckle and a furler (all but the most recent Macs who say NI!!) should inspect it MONTHLY to make sure it hasnt walked off - which leads to demasting. Those without furlers can probably be more lax. The classic failure is the cotter pin inside the furler gets caught on something inside, gets stripped off the turnbuckle, which then unwinds during furler action.

[Matt19020]

I like a "tight" rig
I added a second forestay for redundancy ......
to attach my jib furler I connect a line to the (2nd) forestay thru the anchor roller and back to the winch....crank the winch a little bit and it pulls the mast tight and frees your hands up to "pin" the furler....then i am good to go....
If you do not run the 2nd forestay you MAY be able to attach a line to the jib halyard and do the same thing.....did not try this method..




More info: http://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/v ... 3&start=15

[Phil M]

I haven't done all the vectors but i suspect there is a lot more tension in the upper shrouds than the forestay.

I'm having trouble seeing how a shackle ( horseshoe) will be easily attached to hold the furler. Seems to me to be the same action as pushing a pin, but then you have to thread it under tension

One way to help this issue is to install a quick release lever - see mods

Hmmm, you might be right. I looked in the mods as you suggested, and there was a mod using ball lock pins that I would like to try.

http://www.macgregorsailors.com/modt/index.php?view=21

Phil M

[Catigale]

I recall at least one person has recommended against using quickpins at the forestay, as they can work loose and of course, crash...the mast comes down

They would be ok if you used some kind of retainer, of course.

[Matt19020]

I was one of at least 4 others that I found who have had a mast come down for different reasons.....It is not fun and I would NEVER want to do it again...

[Phil M]

I recall at least one person has recommended against using quickpins at the forestay, as they can work loose and of course, crash...the mast comes down

They would be ok if you used some kind of retainer, of course.

I agree about the quickpins not to be used for standing rigging,

but I do use quick pins for some running rigging, as for the boom gooseneck and the mainsail on the boom, and for my boomkicker, for my bimini and dodger. I was just hoping that a ball lock pin might work for the furler at the bow.



Maybe worrying about the mast falling on my head is not worth the extra minute to fumble with a ring ding

during setup and takedown.

Phil M

[paj637]

My quick release lever mod on my 2006 is by far the best mod I have made in my rigging and makes pinning the forestay so much easier. I think Roger ought to make it a factory installed improvement with the raised mast hound and longer stays. I no longer dread pinning my forestay as the most difficult part of raising the mast. Easily accomplished and inexpensive mod.