Electrical Distribution (DC) Panel Questions

[c130king]

Fellow Mac Modifiers (especially those gifted with knowledge and experience with electrical modifications),

As I sit here in London dreaming and planning my future mods...and ordering things on-line...I have determined that I need to upgrade my electrical panel. Currently have the standard 4-switch panel that came with the boat. Been doing a lot of searching and digging in the archives. Lots of good info...but I need to know more.

I have a new marine stereo and S1 Wheel Pilot sitting at my Dad's house in Florida and will soon have a VHF/DSC radio once I figure out which one I want. So I am pretty sure I need more switches than the 4 I currently have. Additionally everything on my pedestal (GPS/Chartplotter, fuel guage, all motor controls) are wired directly to the battery with no switch (other than the basic on/off battery switch).

Think I need about 8 switchs.

1 - Position Lights
2 - Steaming Light
3 - Interior Lights
4 - Radio & Stereo
5 - Autopilot
6 - DC outlet inside cabin
7 - Pedestal
8 - Spare for future use

A 4-position switch, exactly like the one I currently have, is available from BWY. Thus my first question...

Has anyone installed a second panel in their boat? I was wondering if I could put a second panel similar to the primary one except on the starboard side? Nothing there now except that mirror.

I have seen some of the mods where the panel is moved to a new location...like above the head in the . Don't really want to do that. Do not plan to move my batteries so I think I need/want the panels close to the batteries.

Second question...

Has anyone installed a 8-position switch panel on an somewhere near the current panel?

Appreciate any thoughts on this.

Cheers,
Jim

[Paul S]

yes, a blue sea 8 breaker panel (model 8023.) fits perfectly

FWIW, as you can see in the pic, I added a switch bank (not breakers) for the external lights (steam, sail, anchor, foredeck) off of the 'lights' breaker. I didn't want to blow 4 breakers just for lights alone! see previous post here, along with a diagram for the steam/sail light switch. I put safety covers over the GPS and VHF switches (only one is installed in this pic) because I didn't want to accidently switch either off, especially in an emergency. Pretty easy mod.

There is also a backlight option for the panel. I did get this and install it. Makes life a lot nicer at night.

[c130king]

Paul,

Thanks. I was pretty sure I had seen your post before but I didn't see it this time I looked. That is the info I am looking for.

But this 8-switch panel is $142 at Defender. And then I need 2 or 3 additional circuit breakers at $15 each.

I could get a second 4 position panel from BWY and I think their price was $32 and then I would have two seperate panels.

But I think your set up looks a lot nicer. And good to confirm that it fits an in that "shoulder" area of the cabin.

And I can always add the 3-switch bank, similar to yours, for the lights at a later date if I find I need to free up some circuit breakers for future add-ons...hmmm maybe a flat screen TV and DVD player.

Ahh, it's only money.

Thanks again,
Jim

[Paul S]

The panel is worth the $. It is well made. plus it comes with 5 breakers already.

backlight- if you want to read the labels at night - http://bluesea.com/productline/overview/230

[mike uk]

You'll want to think about the neg side of the circuit as well. I don't know about the M but the X has a neg "stud" (ie a bolt and nut) in a pretty inaccessible place behind the switch panel. Additional components neg wires had been wired direct to the battery by the first owner. Bit of a "spaghetti junction" (in fact, close examination revealed connectors of different sizes not sitting flat against each other on the battery terminal - guaranteed to loosen off in time!)

As part of a project to install an extra house battery and an additional switch panel, I also added neg bus bars which enable individual and much neater (and therefore better) connections. Small wires from the components are connected to the bus bars and then a single heavier gauge wire goes to the battery.

Mike

[Paul S]

The M has a bolt by the panel as well. Not hard to access (you can see it in my pic)

The panel has a neg rail on it that I attached the new circuit too, and just pigtail the junction to the panel. Not a big deal. This (IMO) was a very easy modification.

[c130king]

As I load up my shopping cart on Defender.Com can someone please just confirm for me what amperage circuit breakers would be needed.

The panel comes with five 15-Amp breakers. I plan on buying two more. They will be for the following:

1 - Position Lights
2 - Steaming Light
3 - Interior Lights
4 - Radio & Stereo
5 - Autopilot
6 - DC outlet inside cabin (probably run a small 150 watt inverter eventually for laptop/cell phone charging etc...)
7 - Pedestal
8 - Spare for future use

I assume 15-Amp will be fine for all of these...5-Amp, 10-Amp, and 15-Amp breakers are all the same price on Defender.

Appreciate any help.

Thanks,
Jim

[atzserv]

Jim,

When I added my Raymarine S1 autopilot the manual asks you to run a (check your manual to make sure I am correct on the wire size.)10 guage wire direct with a 25 amp fuse. I followed the Raymarine suggestion. This had me with a single switch that i still need to run to the pedistal. It gets a little confusing when all the fuse holders are 12 ga. I use a 12 ga fuse and located it just after my perko switch to keep it close to the batteries. It has always worked fine for me. Even finding a switch rated at 25 amps was a problem if I recall. I think I went with one rated at 20 amps. It might be a good idea to have your dad send you the install for the autopilot so you can get all the specifics. The motor in the autopilot is the reason for these higher limits. I seem to remember also if you run a long enough wire you need an 8 guage. You should be ok on the Mac with 10 ga. I got my wire on ebay, marine grade stuff.

Gary

[dvideohd]

If you do wiring....

I might suggest a label maker
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/st ... assNum=249

that and clear heat shrink over the labels - or something similar....

I have done crude things such as folding orange or green duct tape over a wire, trimming, and writing the item on the duct tape... I keep track of power suppliers - this way... like +12V - 0.5A and CENTER = POSITIVE. This is almost necessary for having a small box of power adapters. I don't recommend this for any kind of boat or long term wiring... I was just content to keep my transformers sorted.....

It's also good to label the circuit with a number... and log it to a paper - which gets laminated when done.... I know you don't need this now... but 5 years from now, some night... you might...

A fiend drew repeated wiring diagrams with Visio and other free public programs... he claimed that doing this let him design at a SYSTEMS level - and thus save money on the electronics as a whole..... I think he was also impatient when not being on the water....

So you question brings up a few other ideas... and you have enough circuits to do something simple for wiring labels and documentation..

if you can, stick with marine wiring.... (ie, plated)....

there is liquid tape out there - that is darned useful, too.....

Fused circuits don't need to "blow" anymore... resettable is good.....

have fun!!

--jr

[c130king]

Paul, Mike, Gary, JR,

Thanks for the inputs. More to consider.

Jim

[DaveB]

Duck Tape is conductive, don't use it for wireing covers.
As a Building Inspector for the City a fellow inspector lifted a suspended ceiling Panel and contacted with a Duck Tape wire and was electrified and out of work for 6 mo. with brain problems.
Dave
I have done crude things such as folding orange or green duct tape over a wire, trimming, and writing the item on the duct tape... I keep track of power suppliers - this way... like +12V - 0.5A and CENTER = POSITIVE. This is almost necessary for having a small box of power adapters. I don't recommend this for any kind of boat or long term wiring... I was just content to keep my transformers sorted.....

[Hardcrab]

Don't forget the in-line 20A from the Battery to the Panel already exists.
15 amp fuse will be fine for all of your branch circuits described, as long as you keep the wire size adaquate, nothing smaller than 14 AWG.
12 AWG will work very nice, overkill for the radio, steaming light, but so what, it's your money we're spending.
A dead short will pop the fuse/breaker and that's the real demon being protected from.

Why not double up some like loads on breakers and save money and stuff to break?
The switches can remain the same.
Have an exterior lights breaker. 15 A
Interior lights and radios. 15 A
Autopilot and pedestal. 15 A
DC outlet. 15 A
Spare. 15A

[dbcounihan]

I suggest that you put the VHF radio on a separate circuit breaker from the stereo and all other items. Coming from an aviation background, I've learned to keep "safety of flight" items switched separate from "normal use items".
Dale
26M
Y.B.Normal

[Highlander]

I ran 8 g to my panel so I can run lots of amps from there, here is a pic of the wiring on its way up to the panel this cut out is for my main 120v circuit breaker panel
http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee20 ... 010072.jpg

Now this ciruit breaker/ switch panel I bought brand new from my marina flea mrkt for I think it was $15. I will most likely install in my pedestal


as you can see it comes with its own wiring harness already installed
http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee20 ... 010097.jpg

J

[markh1f]

Jim
You might want to look at one of these:
http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?pat ... id=1131356

About $60 cheaper and waterproof which is not a bad idea as close at it will be mounted to the main hatch.

Mark