Sail mods, success stories...???

[Bill at BOATS 4 SAIL]

Retail price is $1,550 for a Mac. I looked into it with the thought of becoming a dealer for them. I didn't think there would be a lot of response at that price.

[Casey]

Waternwaves

I remember the first year I bought my Mac, I was on a Lake(name eludes me) in the Grand Tetons, a Venture sailboat by the name of Windsong wished to have a small race. The wind was light. We each put up our mains and foresail. I was actually going faster than they until they put up their second head sail. They left me quite steadily. Since then, I have always wondered if a second headsail would increase sailing speed in light wind. I also have wondered about a lot of sail improvements and have thought about centerboard slot drag. One idea that I had on the centerboard slot was to use a thin stiff but flexible plastic sheet on either side of the centerboard trunk that met in the center. The centerboard would be able to slide between when dropped or raised. May even help sideslip but may make it heel more.

Keep up the ideas. I enjoy them.

[craiglaforce]

OK, I'll offer a few thoughts on improving sail performance.
1) First, Balance the rig. The helm should be well balanced or else you get a lot of rudder drag that slows the boat. (should not exceed 3 degrees of rudder angle to counteractslight rudder helm. On my boat this was accomplished by adjusting the forestay turnbuckle to shorten it about an inch from the factory setup.
2) I decided that since the winds where my boat is at hit 15-20 mph almost every day, that a 110% jib was what I wanted to keep on the furler. Bought it at CD sails "cruising direct" Also helps going upwind because of better sheeting angles and easier to keep the boat on its feet.
3) make sure you fully hoist the mainsail, releasing the vang and sheets before raising the sail. Get it as tight as you can.
4) adjust the outhaul tension to trim the mainsail for the conditions.
5) I sort of tie a hokey cunningham on the main to help bring draft forward a bit. I really, really wish I had ordered a cringle for this. Bu even just wrapping the little line around a slug and pulling it down and tieing it helps a lot. I really miss the adjustable sliding gooseneck that I had on my last boat. I am really tempted to install one on the 26X. I think this would make a huge improvement.
6) make small steering movements so as not to stall any surfaces.
7) keep the boat as steady as possible. Induce heel with crew placement in light air.
8) tensioned rig where I wanted it by installing turnbuckles on the shrouds.
9) installed aditional mast track to give more options as to placement of the jib block. Sometimes this helps it point a lot better. The new track is aft of the old track.
10) really be aware of wind shifts and patterns. Keep an eye upwind to see the ripples on the water and what is about to hit you.
11) 2nd set of reef points on my new mainsail was a very good improvement. Now I can take a modest reef to handle 20-24 mph winds and still have excellent sailing speed and control.
12) Installed an inverted "V" mainsheet pulley arrangement, anchored to the genoa tracks via slider cars and spring shackles. Feels more solid than using the helm console to anchor the mainsheet control, also makes gybes much more controlled and gentle, and also provides adjustment a little like a traveller. A second set of fiddle blocks could be used to tweak the boom position and tension to fully emulate a traveller.
13) tellales on the shrouds (hard plastic type that pivots). I like this best for sailing. A windvane on the top of the mast is less useful because you have to crank your neck badly to see it and you lose sight of the jib telltales if you are looking up.
14) cross-sheeting the jibsheet lets you adjust it without putting your crew weight on the leeward side.
15) I think it sails best with the centerboard only down 1/2 to 2/3 of the way. Not really sure why, but it seems faster there to me.

Is that enough?

[TampaMac]

Personally I think that kitesail idea is sound.

Once launched it doesn't need your rigging - it is attached to the hull.

Hence:

1. You have a more stable pull with less danger of a lean from a sudden wind shift.

2. You can carry more square footage because it is not stressing out your rig.

3. Since it lifts as well as drags you have less hull in the water and can literally reduce the effective weight you are dragging through the H2O.

4. It is a good emergency rig should your mast get blown down - since you don't need a mast.

I bet under the right conditions you could really get up on a plane and do the 17 mph or better that Roger claims. Maybe over 20 mph?

Unfortunately I contacted the kitesail people. He gave me a quote of $2120.00 for a 550 square foot model.

He did say that if I wrote up a report etc. on my experiance with it for Macgregor consumption he'd give me a 20% discount or $1696.00.

I thought that was an OK price for a cutting edge item that he apparently has a monopoly on. But Bill at Boat sales said that it retailed for $1550 - so I offered $1400.00 and said that I could write up an article (I have some articles published in magazines - not sailing stuff) that would probably be good for his sales.

I got no response. I'm still thinking about paying the $1700.

I did do something today which seemed to take about half the play out of my steering. I merely added some 3/8's inch washers to each of the connection points of the steering linkage. I added a bunch so that when I finally put in the cotter key each was pretty tight.

Now half the play is gone. It was a huge improvement for about 5$ worth of stainless steel washers and some lithium grease.

[Catigale]

Not trying to offend anyone, but just did my last October sailing trip on the Hudson before we resort back to trailering.

Catigale is a straight up 2002 rigged with the 150 Genoa on the CDI furler. I had full sail plan up.

When the wind came up to 15 mph steady for several minutes at a time, held 30 degrees off the stern I held >7 mph (indicated by GPS) during the breeze...I logged over one mile with a peak of 8.1 mph.



I would describe my rigging, mast rake, (and sailing technique) as non-optimal.

I dont believe this boat is difficult to acheive these results as I am just not the great a sailor.

I have my wind vane set at 35 degrees to wind, I can routinely point to this, and with the help of an experienced sailor earlier this summer, have pointed her to within 30 degrees of the wind.

What are you guys expecting to make better (or am I missing the point that this is a brainstorming only thread)???

[normo]

Craig

This is an excellent list. A couple other thoughts.

Few things will destroy performance more effectively than a fouled bottom, centerboard or rudders. It doesn't take much. In many saltwater locations even two weeks can cause sufficient fouling to noticeably affect performance. A few months ago I took a test ride on a 26M. Asked the dealer about the beard growing everywhere but he shrugged it off and said not to worry. Suuure! I had never been on a poorer performing sailboat - couldn't point, couldn't tack period. Fortunately the Honda save us from being blown onto the rocks or going downwind to God knows where. I scolded the dealer and he has since called and invited me back explaining that a bottom cleaning made the boat as good as new.

I'm in the process of closing on a 2001 26X. I noticed that the bottom paint was very very rough; the painter must have applied the paint using a broom or spatchela instead of a quality roller. Boat yards are famous for putting on these crappy bottoms and their fees are eyewatering. Insist on a smooth bottom or do it yourself.

Items 1 and 2 could emphasize that excessive heeling really penalizes progress to windward. I'm not familiar with the 26X but most trailerable centerboard or swing keel boats I have sailed on shouldn't be heeled more than 20 degrees tops. Excessive heel causes huge leeway.

[craiglaforce]

Catigale,
the 35 degrees are of course to the apparent wind, not the true wind. Very big difference. It is a simple trig problem to find the real pointing angle if you know wind speed and boat speed, or you can simply run close hauled on one course, then tack, and measure the compass swing. If you can do 90-100 degrees then you are doing well I with the 26X I would think. The large genoa will of course give you more speed on a beat or off the wind, and is lots of fun, but will penalize you a bit on pointing angle because it can't be sheeted in as tightly as a 110% or less jib. I dont know exactly how much, but it doesn't take much peanlty to really hamper upwind progress. But if you mainly just go back and forth across the wind, then its the best.

[Catigale]

Craig - thanks. The apparent vs true wind point slipped by me of course.

I have a GPS track from my infamous May 2004 trip with my Kiwi friend showing we were swinging 80 degrees on tacks - this was certainly a measure of his trimming ability, not mine. This was in 20-25 mph winds, standard reef in main, and about 100% of genoa out. In my log I noted that once we heeled past 10 degrees the performance dropped off and the leeway was brutal.

On the upper Hudson, its tough to get more than a 1/4-1/2 mile run without a tack so its not the best place to test your trimming!

For running, I had a lot of fun this weekend alternating between goosewinging that full 150 Genny out when I could, then, when I had to tack, coming over onto a broad reach - the Genny would fill with the apparent wind 35 degrees of the stern and I would be off to the races at 7+ mph. I was singlehanded so it was a bit busy in the cockpit.

[Catigale]

Just to close loop I pulled one of my 30 degree apparent logs and calculated I was 44 degrees to the true wind just like Craig pointed out.

[Andy26M]

Referring back to WaternWaves' initial posts here-

I have a 2004 26M with the 150 Genoa on the roller furler. I sail on the lower Narragansett mostly - out of Newport, RI. In the summer, we generally have steady 15+ knot winds out of the SW, and often a lot more than that.

I have often wished for the ability to fly a storm jib because the genoa is much less than optimal when partially furled - it does not have good shape and as you furl it, the center of effort rises vertically instead of staying low like it would with a purpose-cut heavy weather sail.

So, I've contemplated a second forestay many times. I think my solution, though, would be to move the furler forward about 6-8" on a small stainless sprit (the pulpit would have to be split or modified) and then add a "Solent" type stay right where the original forestay is. A solent stay is detachable at the base - when using the Genny, the solent would be detached at it's base forward and connected off to the side near the shrouds to keep it out of the way of tacking the Genny. The solent would remain a bare wire so you could hank on a storm jib or even a 90, 100, or 110 jib if you wanted.

By locating the solent and regular stays close together on some kind of metal fabrication, it seems to me that you would not need much, if any, fiberglas strengthening, especially since you'd not be flying both sails at once (my idea has nothing to do with haveing a cutter rig, but rather is meant to afford the ability to have good sail shape in higher winds while still keeping the convenience of the roller-furled genoa).

Looking at my 26M, aft of the foredeck hatch, I'm not sure the deck could be strengthened enough to handle a real inner forestay for a cutter rig - at least not without running something down through the V-berth to hold the tension and keep from pulling the deck right up.

I'd also incorporate a better anchor handling roller/mount with the changes on the bow.

- AndyS

P.S. Waternwaves - somewhere here there is also a pic of an extendable bowsprit and a new style spinnaker that I seem to recall might become an actual MacGregor Option for the 26Ms - not exactly a cutter rig, but does open the idea of adding the second forestay forward, vice aft, of the base forestay...

[Catigale]

Also forgot to mention that I have job fairleads on the front of the companionway which I use when close hauled. This helps pointing quite a bit.

FOr flying, I come to the back of the cockpit onto the Genny fairleads.

Stephen

[Bill at BOATS 4 SAIL]

Hey Catigale - I'm not quite sure where you have your jib fairleads on the front of the companionway. More detail please.
I plan on selling the larger spinnakers at a discount when they become available, but the latest I got from MacGregor is the "large spinnakers are still on the 'things to do list', but at this time I don't expect anything before the end of the year. I have no information on price of the spinnaker system."

[Catigale]

Bill - I think the jib fairleads are in the standard position - alongside hatchway, just aft of mast. They look the to be the same as the genny fairleads which are on the coamings on each side of the cockpit.

If you need a picture please email?

sps

[Bill at BOATS 4 SAIL]

No picture needed. When you said you had "fairleads on the front of the companionway", I thought you may have come up with a different way of doing something. Always interested in trying something new.

[Catigale]

Im British ancestry, so getting me to :try something new " is a frequent complaint of my wife - I guess thats why we have a pool guy, and no pool yet....

cheers