1979 V22 - New owner with questions.

[bmxer]

... not to mention toxic.

Check this out. A venture 24 rebuild. Drop down to week 12 for the keel rebuild.

[briantousignant]

Well that Venture 24 story is certainly interesting. I will not know the whole story of my keel until the spring when I drop it from the boat. I choose the drill test with a battery drill and 1/8 bit. The resulting drill chaffs where fine particles with no large chips or spirals. The material was quite hard compared to mild steel to my surprise but I guess that goes with the brittle nature of cast iron ? My interest in leading is to seal the surface with something that really bonds and stands up to the knocks. The body people only heated the immediate area that they worked on but that was for thin steel. More research !

[Catigale]

Just to swag it last time I checked into this cast iron is about 0.25 USD per pound while lead is about 1.00 USD per pound...

Ergo 400-500 USD in raw materials for the keel alone!!!!

[RobertB]

OK

To be up front, I have not filled dents with lead. But I have soldered and brazed and welded - and I believe the basic principle that applies to what by definition is a brazing operation (bonding two dissimilar metals via heat) is that both metals need to be heated sufficiently. The sheet metal on a car is really thin and easy to heat a localized area quickly - before enough energy is introduced that spreads to the entire body panel. In contrast, a keel is a large mass of iron/steel (from your discussion, sounds like could be iron) where you are likely to need to heat the entire mass to get any part of it hot enough. Really sounds like a non-starter. I could be wrong.

On the other hand, I do recommend physically and then chemically cleaning the metal - that may mean the entire mass to make sure it is done correctly (edges not treated correctly can ruin an entire job) - and coat/fill with a well researched and correct resin, urethane, or polyester material. A few layers of fiberglass over the entire keel and even extra reinforced abrasion protection on likely wear areas will likely yield a long lasting refinishing job.

[Ormonddude]

You could look into Hot Dip Galvanizing they will acid dip it clean then rust proof it there is a place in Tampa, will do a entire trailer for about a grand most likely be about a hundred Bucks for a Board just a thought I have no idea if you have a service like this near you.

[briantousignant]

Thanks for the comments ! I guess the first step is to decide to repair or replace. There have been a number of comments on how fragile the cast iron keel can be. Is there any known documented cases of the total failure or loss of a keel ? I am leaning towards a clean up, epoxy or other coating followed by fairing and antifouling paint. When and if the keel meets its end on an Ottawa River rock then its decision time.

[Catigale]

Brian...we get about 8 posts a year from someone who just bought or found a free Venture boat that "just needs a keel"

These projects usually die shortly after the person finds out the costs and logistics of keel replacement. Keels are not available from the manufacturer or aftermarket sources...they have to be custom fabricated and transported which ends up costing 1500-2500 USD....

Classic keel loss is failure of pivot pin due to corrosion followed by a plunge into Davey Jones locker.

[bmxer]

I wonder how many keels are under 20ft or so of mud? It would drop like a knife and bury itself good.

Anyway, I just discovered the the majority of lines on the boat have a braided cover, but a poly core. Same stuff you can get at a hardware store. I was going to splice in an in a eye when I noticed

So the question is ... how much pull, how much capacity are the lines holding. I replaced the main halyard already with 5/16 sta-set... how much weight it being placed on it? What about the jib halyard? I'm using that to help pull the mast up when I step it.


Also, what shackles are people using. The PO had small aluminum carabiners ... not good, so I replaced the main with a headboard shackle.


What should the Jib/Genoa be? Suggestions?

[briantousignant]

Well I just replaced my pivot bolt (1/2 inch SS) which was not badly corroded but was visibly (just) bent and I had to drive it out. New one just needed a slight tap to insert. Based on cast iron engine exhaust manifolds which in the old days had a habit of cracking, I thought the failure would be caused by grounding. If I was going to replace, a mild steel plate with a boss at the pivot point and beefed up with lead weight would be my approach. Anything built by someone as a one off would be too expensive. I once owned a Matilda 20 which had a steel drop down keel with a lead bulb torpedo. Worked well but not a racer for sure.

[bmxer]

Something I've read about ... the pivot bolt hole is considerably bigger then the bolt being used. This allows the keel to lean into the keel trunk, taking the pressure off the bolt. Anyone with more info on this .... and shackles

[Ormonddude]

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/st ... HKREFG5zKc I use these on my halyards - the shackle you have there is for the head sail at the mainstay chainplate

[briantousignant]

Well I eye balled my pivot bolt hole after removing the bolt and it is the same dia right through. Basically the fit was tight except for some corrosion etc. The bolt removal, inspection and lubrication sounds like annual event. Does anyone have any recommendations for the bolt spec

[bmxer]

Lots of talk about flotation, but where can you get replacement foam? I know about using some some pool mattresses, but what I'm looking for is the OEM foam blocks.
Looked at dock floats but they're mostly plastic with expanding foam used to fill them up ... so they're kind pricey.

Any suggestions?

[stone_love]

If you want a free block of dock foam come ride around on my lake. In a few hours you'll find several.


As for the keel....do you have a local metal scrap yard?



A 2ft x 5ft 3/4 inch steel plate weights about 400 lbs. 1"thick right at 500 lbs.



If you can use a torch grinder and some fiberglass/body filler you can make your own keel for less than 500.

[SeamanLou]

The horn cleat at the top of stalk is the key. A piece of line through the hole in the forward side of the rudder threaded up through the pintle brackets to the cleat will hold it down. The same rig through the aft holes holds it up for launching. By the way: Noticed that your rudder stops a little aft of vertical (parallel to the pivot line). This adds to the tiller pressure. I recut the stalk to improve mine.

As to the tracks, mine were gone when I got the boat ('70 V22). Rather than replace them, I am experimenting with a "tweeker" type rig. All the jib tracks really do is to control the angle that the sheet pulls on the clew. The tweeker consists of a block through which the sheet is threaded and a turning block followed back to a cam cleat. Finely adjustable under load (unlike the car/track system).

Email me if you want details.