Replacing the 26M Daggerboard

[Rumdirty]

I'll do a bit more of a proper write-up of my second sail (in which my Admiral came out with me) but tonight I need to simply get a question out.

I need to replace my Daggerboard. Yes I know certain geniuses can rebuild it from scratch, I'll attempt to rebuild my current one at a later date and keep it as a spare. In order to continue to sail this summer I need to replace the daggerboard now.

Bluewater Yachts has one for 550 plus another $60 for crating and shipping. It's the original oem replacement.

I also noticed one at this site http://www.ruddercraft.com/catalog/prod ... cts_id=507 that might be an upgrade for 688. Not too much of a price increase if it is indeed a better board (by that I mean stronger).

I'm also open to anything else anyone can recommend.

Unless you're willing to come to my home and build a new daggerboard while teaching me, repairing it is out of the question for now. I hit something hard, it compressed and literally blew out the back of it. There's a big chunk missing that I could feel underwater while trying to force the thing back up into the slot so we could get the hull out of there.

Sailing downwind without a board is still fun as hull I just motored back at the end of the day. :

[NiceAft]

Why do you believe the Rudder Craft board is superior?

Daggerboards don't do well when they come in contact with an immovable object. I would not be surprised if the outcome would not have been different with the Rudder Craft product.

Ray

P.S. If I remember correctly, you go sailing in a shallow area on the Jersey coast.

[RobertB]

It is obvious you may not want to hear this, but rebuilding a two dimensional item such as a daggerboard is really quite easy - and most of the work will take up the better part of an evening and require at least one power tool. Plus, no one will be able to comment on whether you made it look pretty or not. Some fiberglass matting (for fill), fiberglass cloth, polyester or epoxy resin, and a random orbit sander are about all it takes. You do not even need to worry about gel coat. Cut back and taper the damaged areas, fill with wet matting (overlapping the damaged area on the inside for reinforcement) and cover with wet cloth. Sandpaper on a board makes a quick fairing board. Lay the fiberglass cloth on in progressively larger sizes. So, I would spend about 1/10 the cost of new and have the board fixed long before one could be shipped from the west coast (and I did so soon after I became a new owner). Unless your board is in two pieces, I doubt your damage is any worse than many of us have experienced.
If you are set on spending money for a new item to save time (?), I would contact each vendor to see what the on-hand stock is and what the shipping time is. Both boards are likely to perform the same.

[Lee Ward]

Sorry to hear this. Other than buying new or repairing the old one, I've got nothing. I'm looking for a salvage M for the head bulkheads and door, but I'm not holding my breath. I'll give you $50 plus shipping for the broken one if you buy a new one, I'd like to have a spare. PM me if interested. Good luck.

[frede]

My design for the swing daggerboard, I designed it after a broke my first one. A line running through the leading edge would would hold it in place until it hit something then a jam cleat would release it. I replaced the damaged one, but the old one sits in my garage on my todo list, just need more time and talent.

[Rumdirty]

Yup, lots of shallow water along the Jersey (New Jersey USA) coast. I don't know if the Rudder craft board is superior, which is why I was asking if anyone had experience with it. I simply don't know. At this point I'll probably call BWY and order an oem replacement.

Plan is to order a new one and get back to sailing. As time allows I'll rebuild the broken one (thanks to the great info found on this board, Robert's clear explanation, and of course YouTube. I'll be keeping it as a spare because I'm positive this will happen again during my sailing career

That reminds me, get jam cleats for the rear rudders.

Frede - Have you already built that daggerboard? Love to see some photos. I still need to be able to retract it fully.

[Russ]

Have you removed the board yet? Unstep the mast and it will lift right out. Gonna have to do this anyway to replace it.
Many folks here have crunched their daggers. When grounding, often the pressure on the rear of the foil of the board takes the crunch.
I gotta agree with others. If you know a buddy who is handy, or a body shop, you might find a case of beer would buy you a repaired board. Unless it's cut in two, it's probably not that bad. I'm all thumbs with this kind of stuff, but I'd give it a try before tossing it in the bin.


Checking the specs, the M has a draft of 5' 9" with the board down. Wow! That's a lot. I generally keep the board fully down unless under power. You CAN'T do this in Barnegat bay. The average depth of the bay is only 6' and that was before Sandy dumped houses and cars in the middle. Going forward, you may want to mark you daggerboard line. The boat draws 1' board up, so every foot maybe get a marker and label the draft of each setting. My Hunter's draft was 4' 3" and that was dicey in some places. Often when I hit, it was that pudding mud that would gently stop the boat. Of course that's a steel keel, not a thin fiberglass board. However, on the Eastern shore of the bay it was hard sand and when the boat hit,it HIT hard and it sounded like we hit something big and shook everything. Go slow in shallow water.


Do you have a depth finder? They are generally useless in preventing grounding because by the time you hit it's too late, but you can see if you are in shallow water and need to pull the board up.


Ditto on the ruddercraft board. They make quality products and I would be tempted to buy it from them. However, I'd contact them and ask why theirs is better. Their rudders are superior.


Downwind sailing doesn't need a much board. The board is essentially to keep the boat from sliding sideways, which downwind sailing does not need.


Docking the boat, I NEED the board down. This boat is so light in the water, there is little grip. The board helps keep her more stable. Especially in wind or turning. However, if your dock doesn't have 5' 9" you may need to partially deploy the board.


Pull the board out and take a photo of it. I'm sure there are folks here who are very curious about the extent of damage and repairability. Like I said, a autobody shop guy could probably fix it in 20 minutes.

[Russ]

That reminds me, get jam cleats for the rear rudders.

No you don't.
Another pet peeve of mine among Mac M owners. They seem to like to buy unnecessary hardware.

All you need to do is "cleat" the rudders properly when deployed.
Kind of hard to see from this photo.
Pull the board down and hold the line tight. Now with your other hand, take the slack end of the dagger line and wrap the cleat and put twist to secure it. You will have a bit of slack loop left over. The first wrap will apply tension preventing the board line from loosening and kicking up. However, if you pull hard (like the rudder hitting something) it will pull free.

Tada, and you spent nothing and have a safety for your rudders.

[Russ]

My design for the swing daggerboard, I designed it after a broke my first one. A line running through the leading edge would would hold it in place until it hit something then a jam cleat would release it. I replaced the damaged one, but the old one sits in my garage on my todo list, just need more time and talent.

Love this idea. It would make the M more like an X and prevent many broken fins.

I've also thought the dagger was too small for the M. At low speeds it's not very effective. I would love to build a longer dagger that would hang down a bit when retracted, but be a foot longer when deployed. Would need to be removed before putting the boat back on the trailer though.

[Rumdirty]

All you need to do is "cleat" the rudders properly when deployed.

Russ! What an intelligent and simple fix! You have redeemed yourself from causing me to spend $650 ($150 over budget) for a Garmin chartplotter!

Board is still in the boat (kept on a dock). I'll be heading out to lower the mast and retrieve the board this week. Boat is an hour away. I don't know anyone that would know how to do this but enough folks have stated that it wasn't THAT hard, then my confidence level has increased to the point that possibly even a simpleton like me might be able to repair it. besides, I'd really like to save the $600.

I dunno what I initially hit, I originally thought I was caught on some line and tried to sail off it. Wind had us turn a full 180 which i imagine caused more damage. Next time I'll just straight away lift the board. I kinda forgot it retracted at the moment

My pos depth finder must have been a walmart special as it only shows a reading once every few minutes. I'm supposed to install my Garmin 547xs this weekend coming up. Should take care of that. My docking situation is motoring thru 2nm of canals, making a tight u-turn, then tieing up in 2 foot of water at low tide.

Will have to mark the line and maybe just drop it 3 feet or so. Good idea. I learn something from this group almost daily!

[Russ]

The thing is, you may have totally trashed the board. It is hollow fiberglass and designed to break away rather than damage the hull. Until you pull it you'll never know how bad. Might just be a small crack.

Last year I clipped a cable. The boat pulled to one side and came to a stop. I saw the cable stretched across the marina holding a floating dock in place and thought I must have wrecked the board. Pulling the dagger out, I found it was unharmed.

I know a boat yard in Toms river that does great fiberglass work. http://nelsonmarinebasin.com/ I bet he could do a quick repair if it's not missing the bottom for far less than a new one. Or....google fiberglass repair. It's not that difficult.

As Robert pointed out, you never see the dagger, so if it looks ugly, only the crabs will know.

--Russ

[Rumdirty]

Is it still repairable?

[Russ]

I'm going to say yes, it's repairable. Probably needs someone with a little more glass experience though. Or drop the $600 and buy a new one. It's messy. Needs to be sanded down and all that crud taken off.



Give these guys a call. I know they have done wonders.
Nelson Marine Basin
12 Lake Drive, Island Heights, NJ
tel. 732-270-0022

[Ixneigh]

It may come as a surprise to many guys but...
Longer is not better. When it comes to dagger boards. Plus if it was longer it would stick out the top deck when pulled all the way up. I hardly ever sail with it all the way down as is.
Often I leave it all the way up with just the rudders down. The boat will sail almost a beam reach like that.
That board is repairable however my bet is the cost will approach a new one if the repair is done well.
The kick up hinged dagger looks like it would be very hard to keep rigid. If there is too much flex side to side performance will decrease.

Ix

[Highlander]

most of the time u only need 2-3ft of board down some times I have to go with a little more because I,m cutter or clipper rigged , only time u should have the board fully extended is when pointing into the wind !! or some times in a heaver sea !

J