Honda 50hp 4 stroke

[set37]

Hello...
I am looking at a new 26M and have the Honda 50 horse as the engine.
I would appreciate any input on this engine.
How reliable is this unit.

What kind of fuel consumption has anyone experienced.

Can the engine electrical amps support running an inverter to run an ac unit and other creature comforts?

We sail Florida.....hot and humid

Thanks

[mtc]

. . . like a dishwasher.


where in Florida are you?

We have an '05 M and mounted a 60 hp Merc BF. The original plan was to use the Honda 50, but changed my mind.

I've only heard good things about it, though.

Michael

[set37]

We are close to Ocala and have a large lake(Lake Weir) and an hour away from either coast, give or take 15 minutes. New Smyrna or Yankeetown.

Im' sailing a compac 16 with a 4hp yamaha. This little boat sails and handles like its twice its size and is a rugged performer under the extreme.
We are ready for some creature comforts


What were the factors for your engine choice and how do you like the performance and fuel consumpition?

[kmclemore]

How reliable is this unit.

If it's like all the other Honda cars & equipment I have, your grandchildren will end up still using it. The only reason to get rid of a Honda product I've found is that you've simply gotten tired of using the same d*mned thing over and over again!

[Rich Smith]

I'm very happy with the Honda 50 as a motor...however, where I am (up in Toronto Canada) there are very few Honda mechanics and very few parts. I had my fuel line (from the tank to the motor) stolen over the winter and the first 4-5 marine places I called said they only carried other brand connectors like Mercury etc.

Whatever motor you buy, you may want to make sure you have a local contact for parts etc.

Cheers and Fair Winds!

[Chip Hindes]

Actually, there are a lot of reports on the board of Hondas being quite tempermental.

[vkmaynard]

We got to hand start our Honda today. After four trys it started and charged the battery enough to restart after sailing for the afternoon.

Victor

[Terry]

I have found the honda to be very reliable, so far the only problem I have had is the choke or gas enrichner lever does not always move the other levers under the engine cover enough to start it so I take the cover off and press it by hand. Needs a bit of cleaning and adjustmentt I think. Over all the Honda is a very reliable bullit proof engine and I have only heard good things about it. But, if I could go back I would prefer an engine with better low end torque that can swing a 14" prop, something with more than the honda 2.09:1 gear ratio. The honda may be a very solid engine but it lacks the low end torque that some of the compettitors have. Perhaps the Yamaha HT 60 would fit the bill or better yet one of those 90hp options. In any event a larger diameter prop would be a better fit for the MacBarge.

[argonaut]

Chip's words are concise and accurate. Tempermental.

I bought this particular boat mainly because it came with the Honda 50 HP.
So far this engine's done the most of anything on my boat to keep me off the water.
Granted mine's a '97, but extrapolate your new one a few years.
I'm in Florida and since owning mine (6 mos) I've sustained:

o Dead voltage regulator. Was putting out 15.6 volts. Replaced.

o All three carbs gummed completely shut. Avoidable if you run dry every time I understand. I let mine sit too long without starting. Rebuilt myself, parts were a bugger to get. All local shops have -every- other major brand and chuckle when you ask about Honda parts. $230/4 days for parts from "authorized parts outlet".

o Water pump impeller shredded. Looks like local mechanic's fault who installed it but that didn't make me feel any better. Another $200 for parts, this time 7 days waiting for parts. And I don't live in the sticks.

Incidentally I called four4 local outboard repair places, not wanting to service it myself till I knew it better. Three were happy to come over (mobile is great!), till I said Honda. The fourth said to drag it in and they'd get to it when they got to it, no idea of cost. So much for authorized service.
I said to one guy, gee seems like there's an opening for someone willing to service Hondas. He said to knock myself out. So I bought a manual and parts and did it myself. If it runs OK I'll hang on to it and stock my own parts, 'caus I ain't gettin' any locally.

Now when it runs it's so quiet it's creepy.Even at 3/4 throttle you can have a conversation at normal speaking levels. No smoke or smell either. It's never started first try. Usually takes three or four kicks, so I added another battery. I'm not a good judge of power, all I want to do is sail & get off the weather faster then 5kts, so it works for me.
To work on, it has some plusses. There's a spin-on oil filter, an easy to replace fuel filter, and the spark plugs are easy to get to, though they face the port side. The ignition system is solid-state CDI. Lubrication is oil sump. I think the engine is supposed to have a failure mode that protects it from overtemp but lets it get you home by disabling 3 cylinders of ignition. Mine has overtemp and oil pressure alarms. Fuel delivery is three separate kei-hin carbs. Honda really targeted emissions and fuel economy. These carbs have unbelievable tiny orifices, like bread-tie wire diameter. Charging system is a 10A alternator, big enough to charge the batteries, just.

Reviews on this motor, the BF50A, can be found on "epinions,com", I'd have a look. A review mentions one eating impellers frequently, like two a year, and also mentioned the carb weakness, as did several threads on other boards.
I know a guy with a 9HP Merc that didn't know they had impellers in them after seven years, and he's never had a fuel problem.

For my money, knowing what I know now, I'd be all over a Yamaha, Merc, or a Tohatsu, since they make both of the first two anyway. In-stock parts are much more readily available, as are places that can do the service work. Check around your neck of the woods. Electronic fuel injection made sense for cars, likewise it should for boats. Honda fuel injects it's larger outboards, I think 65HP & above. I'd be happy with a more forgiving motor that was easier to keep running.

Depends on your use, too. If you're a salmon fisherman out at night making a living, far from an authoruzed parts distributor, maybe something else is a better choice. If you're a fishing lodge who rents boats, you have a fleet situation, there are plenty of spares and the a failure doesn't matter as much. Just stock up on spare parts.


Ask me again in a year.

[Moe]

The air-conditioner I referenced in your other post asking about air-conditioning draws 7.5 amps at 120VAC (900 watts) when the compressor is running. An 85% efficient inverter would need 88 amps at 12VAC to provide that. The Honda outboard alternator output is rated at 10 amps, and some of that needs to be reserved for charging the starting battery.

[on edit]Here are the creature comforts when operating off batteries:

The boat's two inside lights run about 1.5A each, so running them both for 4 hours per evening is about 12 amp-hours per evening. A typical car radio consumes about an amp, so four hours of use is 4 amp-hours per evening. A 10W anchor light consumes about 8 amp-hours per evening. We're at 24 amp-hours and you have to put back into the batteries 110% of what you took out. You'll need to run the Honda outboard almost 3 hours per day just to make up for these three lights and a radio, plus the power it took to start itself.

[on edit] If you run a 12V/50W LCD TV (4A) instead of the radio (1A), for four hours, you're looking at another 12 amp-hours per evening, for a total of 36. That's another nearly hour and a half of running with the Honda or other outboard with 10A alternator. Selecting an outboard with a 18-25A alternator could about cut your required daily outboard run-time in half.

[on second edit]This doesn't account for the power used by things used when sailing and the motor isn't running, such as a VHF radio (0.5 amps on standby, 1.0 amp while receiving and as much as 5 amps while transmitting), the GPS and/or sounder, and an autopilot, if any.
--
Moe

[Richard Lisch]

In PR most commercial boat operators use the Hondas, because of their reliability, on their sailing and power cats eventhough the outboard is approx. 25% more expensive (down here) than the competition.
I am very happy with mine and parts and service is readily available.

[Luke]

I have a 1999 Honda BF 50 on my boat.

When it runs I love it.
It is quiet and fuel efficient.

However it is temperamental!
My experiences are similar to Argonauts.
Please read his comments above.

I have no local dealers around my home in northeast Ohio.
The dealer I use is in Riviera Beach, Floridawhere I normally sail.
This dealer usually has to order the parts I need.

The carburetors are the largest problem.
They clog every other year.
The dealer want around $700 to rebuild them.
I now carry, as spare parts, all parts needed for the rebuild.
I purchased a carb synchronization tool.

Impellers are a weak point. Check them frequently. Carry spares.

Voltage regulators fail. If you are a cruiser, carry a spare.

If I had to buy another motor, I would buy a motor that has a larger dealer base, has more power, a larger alternator, and is fuel injected.
I like Billy's (Double XX) fuel injected Suzuki 140 HP with a 40 amp alternator!

Luke Thompson
DreamChaser
26X Honda BF 50
Boardman, Ohio

[Dave X2000 Jac]

This our 6th year with a Honda 2000 BF 50A.
It always starts easily. It's very quiet. It reliably recharges both batteries. It has a very reasonable rate of fuel use. It would be my first choice of motors if our current one ever needs replacing.

Dave "Jac"

P.S. I replace oil, oil filter, spark plugs, and lower end fluid every spring. I also have an in-line gas filter that I replace every spring. Everything else is original - even the impeller, of which I carry a spare.

[Moe]

I can't speak to the Honda 50HP outboard, having only used one once on a rental boat, but I can offer the following:

Honda generators (carbureted) also gum up the jets badly (even with StaBil), if not drained when not in use. I'd highly recommend a fuel-injected outboard. At 205 lbs, the Honda outboards ARE the lightest of the four-strokes, which is an advantage on the 26X, originally designed for a 160 lb two-stroke. The 26M appears to be designed for the heavier 50HP EFI four-strokes (250 lbs or so), because it has much less water ballast in the aft end of the boat. It's also the outboard you see in the MacGregor pictures of the 26M.

The latest versions (2005 and later) of the Yamaha 50-60HP four-strokes are fuel-injected, and they have fairly good dealer network, especially on the coast. It is available in a High-Thrust (low gearing, large diameter prop) version, better for a big load like a Mac (the non-high-thrust models are geared too high for the Mac). The latest Yamahas also use the same 996cc powerhead as the Mercury models. Unfortunately, their alternator is also only rated at 10A (on the website), about right for a single battery system. Those you'd find on a used X or earlier M are likely carbureted.

The Suzuki DF50 is fuel-injected (and has been from the beginning AFAIK) and the alternator is rated for 18A, but the dealer network isn't as large. For example, our nearest dealer here is an hour drive away and the second nearest is 3-1/2 hours. I buy parts mail-order from Browns Point Marine. Like the Honda, it is only available in a smaller lower unit, but it is geared fairly low. There have also been four-stroke Suzuki's sold under the Johnson and Evinrude brand names.

The Mercury four-strokes have been fuel-injected since somewhere around 2001, when they began using a larger discplacement (996 cc) powerhead built in the US (that production just moved to China however ) Previously, they used a carbureted version of the Mercury-Yamaha joint-venture four-stroke. There was also a "Big Foot" version with low gearing and large diameter prop. The non-BigFoot models are really geared too high for the Mac. Some here have had trouble running the control cables in the M's shallow pedestal, but two others (mtc and divecoz) have just acquired an M with the Merc BigFoot and seem to be pleased with the control installation. This same motor is also available in a larger, 60HP version with no increase in size or weight. It is probably the outboard I'd choose for a new M. I have one on our Boston Whaler, and love it. Its alternator is rated 18A on the website and 20A in the service manual. Mercury is a very popular outboard in the US, and there are dealers with service, parts, and supplies all over the country.

I'd also recommend you look at the direct-fuel-injected (DFI) two-stroke Evinrude E-Tec in 50 or 60HP. Its alternator is rated at 25W, a better match for a 3 battery system. I've seen one in action and will attest it is as quiet and smoke-free as a four-stroke. I did detect a slight smell of burned two-stroke oil, but it's nowhere near as bad as traditional carbureted two-strokes. Another advantage is that four-stroke outboards intake air into the cylinder head and thus have intake manifolds on the side, running to the front of the motor, making them wider. The two-stroke intakes air into the crankcase and can be made narrower. Given the narrow transom opening of the M, this could be a significant advantage for stocky owners.

All of the motors above should be very reliable, but then you could get a lemon with any of them. That's why local dealer support is important. Having two local dealers is even better in case you have a bad experience with one of them.

Hope this helps,
--
Moe

[Moe]

I almost forgot... here's an Outboard Comparison Table I came up with. I never did get around to calculating and including a row for the weight/hp of each motor with a fully loaded MacGregor.

--
Moe