Purchasing mid-size SUV for 26X

[tinsley]

Hello,
I am currently doing preliminary research on purchasing a mid-size SUV for towing a 26X (haven't bought it yet because I can't tow it with my Accord . I wanted to elicit feedback from the group with respect to experience and recommendations. From browsing through this forum I understand that some people highly recommend long trucks or full size SUVs for towing but for me it would be most feasible if I purchased a mid-size SUV. I will be towing short distances frequently, around 10-20 miles roundtrip, with the possibility of towing up to 400-500 miles roundtrip infrequently.

The list of vehicles I have come up with is as follows:

volvo xc90 2.5T - 4000#/5000#, 208HP@5000, 236lb-ft@1500-4500RPM, 112.6 in wheelbase

bmw x5 3.0i - 6000#, 225HP@5900, 214lb-ft@3500RPM, 111 in wheelbase

nissan pathfinder - 6000#, 270HP@5600, 291lb-ft@4000RPM, 112.2 in wheelbase

nissan xterra - 5000#, 265HP@5600, 284lb-ft@4000RPM, 106.3 in wheelbase

toyota 4runner sr5 - 5000#, 245HP@5200, 282lb-ft@3800RPM, 109.8 in wheelbase

jeep grand cherokee limited - 6500#, 235HP@4700, 305lb-ft@3600RPM, 109.5 in wheelbase

Thanks...

[jsserene]

I have towed my with a 2001 Nissan Pathfinder from Phoenix to San Diego (400 Miles) with no problems except the rear end sags because of tongue weight. It is rated for 5000 lbs. The 240 H.P. engine is more than strong enough to tow the .
The new Pathfinder is larger and stronger than mine and should be better.
Jeff

[CFCassidy]

You didn't list it, but I tow mine with a Ford Explorer. As long as you get the tongue weight right, it tows like a dream. If the tongue weight is too light, it can get squirley.

Charlie

[Tom Spohn]

I too have the Explorer. What I really like is the ability to lock it into low range 4 x 4, for those runs up the launch ramp. I also like the 5 speed tranny which let me lock out 5th gear for towing, but still get reasonable speed on the highway for towing. If I were shopping for a new vehicle I would want the ability to shift manually in and out of low range--not all AWD vehicles will let you do that. My other car is a SAAB. I don't pull the boat with it, but use it for our other hobbies in the mountains. If you will be in the mountains much the turbo motor is the way to go as the motor always thinks it is at sea-level. I am also impressed by the low RPM for max torque on the Volvo.

[Frank C]

Someone on this list mentioned another one you didn't list. Jeep's Liberty has just introduced a 4 cyl turbo-diesel that can be equipped to tow 5000# max, and I think it's rated for 25 mpg. The wheelbase (104") is short, 174" overall, but it's rated at 295 lbs.ft, the most torque on your list except for the Cherokee V-8..

I'm not a big Chrysler fan, but considering that costs of housing & gasoline are on the same upward spiral, when time comes I might look it over to see if any snags come along with that tow rating.

[NiceAft]

I have a GMC Envoy, and it's been great pulling my 26M.

[tinsley]

The more I read about towing, on this forum and others, the more I'm concerned about sway with the wheelbases of these mid-size vehicles...especially when towing on a highway.

For instance, a few people mentioned towing with a Ford Explorer and a GMC Envoy. The wheelbases of these vehicles are 113.7 and 113.0 respectively. Are there sway problems?

Thx.

[Chip Hindes]

I towed my '01X with a '98 Explorer 4x4 for two years, but no long distances; the furthest was 165 miles home from the dealer where I bought the boat. With the SOHC 4.0 and five speed automatic tranny, power was not a problem.

With special attention to tongue weight (and never, never fill the fuel tanks until you get very close to the launch ramp) the Explorer was, at best, marginal. Semis passing and crosswinds were definitely a problem.

Two years ago, even though I had just finished upgrading my trailer to two axles with four wheel disc brakes, I was not looking forward to my first long distance trip, 1500 miles to FL and back, with that vehicle. Less than two weeks before the trip, the Explorer chose to lunch its transfer case. Rather than spend $2.5K to resurrect a marginal vehicle, I took the "opportunity" to replace it with an Expedition 5.4L V8. Way, way better.

That Explorer (non-IRS) was barely adequate; not at all confidence inspiring. Can't say anything about the newer ones, nor any of the other vehicles you mentioned. Perhaps better suspensions and IRS improves things, but I suspect a lot of the problems were, as you hinted, inherent to the short wheelbase and narrower track compared to a full size vehicle.

The Mac is tall, wide and long and it doesn't necessarily tow as easily as many other 4-5000 lb loads. By the same token, torque and HP alone do not a tow vehicle make. At the almost certain risk of pi$$ somebody off who's already doing it, pulling a Mac with a Jeep Liberty would be foolhardy.

[Terry]

I too had the opportunity to upgrade this year and I followed some of the advice I read on this board and bought a larger tow vehicle. I went from a small '95 two door Chevy Blazer 195hp 260 lbs/ft torque 3600lbs curb weight 100" wheel base to the bigger Chevy Trailblazer Lt/EXT. The EXT designates the longer 129" wheelbase as opposed to the standard 113" wheelbase. This SUV weighs in at just over 5000lbs and has 275hp 275lbs/ft torque and also has the frame integrated hitch, and factory built in trailoring harness, tranny cooler, 7qt oilpan, 3.73 axle ratio and limited slip locking rear differentials, the full meal deal trailering package plus 4X4. (A properly equipped Trailblazer can tow up to 7000lbs). My little Blazer was always a white knuckle ride even though it was rated to tow 5000lbs, the short wheelbase combined with the lighter than trailered load curb weight made it dicey. Another aspect to consider is whether or not the SUV of choice is a car based frame or truck based. The truck based SUV's usually have a steel chassis and heavier springs whereas car based SUV's are based on unibody construction with no real truck chassis, they usually have a softer suspension to emulate car like rides hence the lesser towing capacity. I was fortunate to have some of the opinions on this board to guide my decision and now that I have towed a couple of times I am grateful for it, very happy with the bigger Trailblazer.
Yes, it does burn more gas - 6km/liter but it just floats down the highway like a Cadillac, very nice ride.

[Frank C]

... I understand that some people highly recommend long trucks or full size SUVs for towing but for me it would be most feasible if I purchased a mid-size SUV. I will be towing short distances frequently, around 10-20 miles roundtrip, with the possibility of towing up to 400-500 miles roundtrip infrequently ...

So, guess you'd feel that neither my former '97 Expedition, nor my current full-size Sierra 4x4, would be mandatory for your towing comfort? Considering that it's SOP to use small diesels in Europe, it's possible that we have developed (an unwarranted?) bias toward "big & heavy?" Wonder if our bias evolved from the remarkably cheap fuels in USA until now (& even still)?

Regardless, I still found both the Expedition 5.4 and the Durango 4.7 to be power-anemic ... and not stellar as tow vehicles in spite of their weight. After a half-dozen 1000+ mile trips in various heavies, I definitely prefer towing with the Sierra pickup. (For anyone who's curious, with 3.73:1 gearing, my Sierra 5.3L. gets about the same in constant city hops as it does pulling the Mac at 65 mph on the Interstate, 12 mpg - also the same as the earlier two SUVs). But when the opportunity arises to change, I'm sure I'll choose a diesel for towing, next time.

But ... considering your clearly-defined starting assumptions & usage patterns, your regular 20 mile trips should be fine with any mid-size SUV that has an adequate tow-rating. And just one opinion ... for only one 200-mi. trip per year, I might even be okay with that Liberty diesel, too. (Add the "tracking" benefits of tandem axles to that trailer & it seems like a guaranteed slam-dunk)! FWIW - YMMV.

[NiceAft]

With the GMC Envoy I have traveled several times on the PA Turnpike at 65mph. The only problem has been when 18 wheelers zoom by. I have found that moving over to the right when I see them coming helps a lot.

I did install a transmission cooler, and I do not leave it in overdrive when I start hearing it shift too often.

[Randy Smith]

It isn't about the towing part..........200 ponies will do just about whatever you want. It is about stopping. That is the difficult part. Your vehicle has got to have more weight and braking power than the wieght of your boat. If the boat weighs 4000# loaded, the rig has to weigh more. I have towed with the mid-sized SUV, great power and no problem for short distances. My friends, you hit the hills of the Northwest, or the freeway and the idiots "not contained"out there, you gotta have more beef under the hood, the tranny cooler and the ability to crack her down in a hurry, without the boat coming out in front of the cart.......Again, the mid-size are great for short marina to home gigs, but do go for the full size. It is safer for all involved as well as more comfortable, plus you can plan for that wonderful long range trailer adventure without having to plan for a tranny overhaul or worse when you pull the guts out of the cute little ute. The mileage over a year is not that much more for the value, security and pleasure of the full size.........hope you hear me, done both........ Randy

[Frank C]

... or be sure your trailer brakes are working


(I'm just trying to recognize that keeping a 5000# boat 20 miles from a launch ramp doesn't mandate the purchase, care & feeding of a monster tow vehicle. I have a full-size pickup, many here want even bigger, but it's not necessarily mandatory for every Mac owner. If I just needed 20 miles each weekend, I'd be thinking mid-sized too).

[Robert]

Whatever tow vehicle you choose keep in mind the suspension performance. The silky smooth "boulevard ride" of the cushy luxery vehicles also allows plenty of give in the suspension which means more sway. My Mac26X towed behind an Isuzu Trooper with stiff full frame and performance shocks and firmly inflated truck tires and springs does not have a sway problem even with passing semi's. At the same time when towed by a huge heavy conversion van which was setup with that boulevard ride and car tires was scary and would sway a lot even after just hitting a small pothole. The tongue weight in both cases was identical around 10%. (Note: my Trooper gets 11mpg towing, 19.5 mpg hywy, and in the UK with a turbo diesel would get 31 mpg)
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Many SUVs can have their suspension springs and shocks upgraded (around $60 per wheel each) and with good tires (around $150 per wheel). The result is a much better performing SUV, way less leaning or nose dive for example, which makes it safer to drive.
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After 2006 the USA will require low sulfur diesel fuel, with low sulfur diesel fuel diesels will burn cleaner than gasoline engines and Isuzu, VW, and Mercedes made dieselds will become available in many many vehicles. So maybe get a used SUV on the cheap now (a 3 year old Suburban or Expedition maybe) and plan to upgrade in 2007 or 2008 to a fuel efficient diesel hybrid SUV.
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There is available a hybrid Chevy pickup. Hybrids get a tax incentive.
http://www.gmc.com/sierra/index.jsp then click hybrid on bottom of page to get a popup view of the hybrid workings.
http://www.gm.com/company/gmability/adv ... eline.html
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Ford's Excursion SUV can come with their diesel, with this you would have to look in the rear view mirror once in a while to notice if the Mac26X is even there at all. http://www.fordvehicles.com/suvs/excursion/ The diesel engine is updated and very nice, a friend of mine has this tank like vehicle for towing his camper and boat: http://media.ford.com/newsroom/release_ ... ease=12660

[Tom Spohn]

I think Frank C. and Robert are touching on a very important aspect of any new tow vehicle--namely fuel economy. Although I am happy with my '02 Explorer, I will replace it when the time comes with the most fuel efficient vehicle that is on the market at the time. The Jeep will be on my list for example, as will whatever hybrid vehicles are available. Since this technology (diesel and hybrid) is just taking off I am hoping better vehicles will be available in a few years. Of course I wouldn't buy a vehicle that was not capable.

One aspect of towing that I am curious about is the dynamic one. I am assuming that the capability of the tow vehicle must increase as the speed increases. At low speeds could we live with less capable vehicles? One of the things I noticed in my last trip to Spain was the large number of trailers of all sizes that were being pulled by 4 cyl. diesel cars. They were only going 45 or 50, but they were getting there.

With fuel prices going up and our dependence on imported oil increasing, do we need to go down the interstate at 70??