Honda 50 + Wood Boat and Motor (rant - never again!)

[Paul S]

We had the exact same thing happen to our Honda on our second time out in our newly purchased used 26X (stuck in reverse while trying to pull onto the trailer). It wasn't pretty.

While I am no outboard motor expert, I can't resist trying to ferret out the causes of problems like this, and quickly located it the next day (same thing... shift linkage nut came loose). I reconnected it, and tightened the locking nut... it's been fine ever since.

Regarding Woods: I can't believe they are behaving like this. I'm a graphic artist/prepress guy/web developer/scanner operator/photo retoucher. My time is all I have to sell, and I can't afford to give it away in substantial quantities. But I also recognize that a little unbilled time here and there spent helping clients is not going to sink me, and goes a long way towards building and maintaining goodwill. I could partially understand if it was some major problem that would cost $1000 or so to repair... but to stubbornly INSIST on charging someone $75 for such an insignificant "repair" (especially considering the fact that, as has been exhaustively pointed out, the problem was almost certainly a result of the recent repair job done by this same shop, a point that goes conspicuously unaddressed in the dealer's post in this thread). My guess is that it is a "you didn't buy the motor from us, so we're going to squeeze every penny we can out of you" situation. Either that or they are afraid that by not charging you, they'd be admitting neglect/negligence. Accusing you of loosening the nut yourself is the icing on the cake.

Regarding Honda: this "if a motor fails while it is being used, it is not a defect" thing has to be one of the most ridiculous statements I've ever heard of. Just recite that line in your head a few times and think about it. There HAS to be more to that side of the story... perhaps the customer service person misread the script text on the computer screen, or was misinformed in some other way. I mean, if I buy a brand new Honda, take it out, and a piston rod goes flying through the case, that's not a defect? My Honda's CDI failed last year, and it's safe to say that it happened while the motor was running... was not not a defect either? (it was covered by a third party warranty purchased by the previous owner)

Anyway, our Honda, aside from the failed CDI (which was an intermittent problem that only occured when the motor was run hard for a few hours) and the linkage coming loose, has been a great motor. It's relatively quiet, fuel efficient, and has been perfectly reliable (again, aside from those 2 issues about 1.5 years ago). However, I'm with argonaut... if/when the time comes to repower, though there's a slight chance I'd stick with Honda, I'll probably look elsewhere.

--Mike

On the honda comment....I am not clear if that was refering to my case only...or everything. It did not make sense to me..so I had her explain it. Apparently..since the motor was operating normally...then the rod became disconnected while the motor was in use..it is not considered a mfr defect....thus not covered...I reeeeeeeeaaaalllly need to know how the rod could become disconnected if the motor was NOT on. Again.. not sure if it is just specific parts...or everything.

I just can not get over that Wood would just not do it as, at minimum, a good will gesture.

I guess they don't want to form long term customers, or have enough customers and do not care. Just bad customer service. Even if they are right...(which they are not IMO)...a 3 minute repair would go a long way to securing a customer and having them recommend them. But I guess pi$$ one off, and have them blow off steam online, and have hundreds of people read it, is a better option....

I should start a website www.woodboatandmotorsucks.com

Paul

[Moe]

Sloop, I wanted to get home and check my Merc service manual before committing to a response, but that motor, and I assume the Yamaha, rotate the shift shaft to change gears. The Suzuki DF50, and it sounds like the Honda, move the shaft up and down vertically to change gears. As Argonaut describes, if it's disconnected, you can get the motor in forward from neutral, or neutral from reverse, as the top shaft pushes the bottom one, but you can't shift in the opposite direction where the top shaft is usually pulling on the bottom one through the connection.

Frank, the DF50 doesn't use a clip. It uses a jam nut like the Honda.

[Mark Prouty]

OK.....

Let's add insult to injury.

Honda called back. They looked into it. Apparently the motor is a Canadian Honda motor, not Honda USA So there is no warranty through Honda USA!

Seriously though....how much worse can it get..now I have a motor with no warranty.... You seriously have to be kidding me!!!!

Have a call in with Havencraft to see what can be done.

Paul

Any word from Havencraft?

[Paul S]

OK.....

Let's add insult to injury.

Honda called back. They looked into it. Apparently the motor is a Canadian Honda motor, not Honda USA So there is no warranty through Honda USA!

Seriously though....how much worse can it get..now I have a motor with no warranty.... You seriously have to be kidding me!!!!

Have a call in with Havencraft to see what can be done.

Paul

Any word from Havencraft?

Did not do anything. Stood by wood that somehow I f*cked with the lower unit/linkage and was not covered under warranty (havencraft warranty, as my motor has no Honda USA warranty, as it is an illegal motor.

Paul

[Tony D-26X_SusieQ]

Sounds about typical for Honda repair mechanics. Mine told me 10 days for a 2 hour job. He kept the boat 5 weeks before he finished the work. I suppose he only works 2 days a week. No sorry or explination of any kind. Yea he will get my work again next time! Oh yea the problem was my fault too. Seems to be a common explination though nobody was accusing him or anyone. *hit happens, I just wanted it checked and fixed. I do have to give credit where credit is due though. The problem was fixed and hasn't happened since. I would not have a motor that I could not count on to start. I guess it is unresonable to expect some kind of customer service from these dealers.

[Catigale]

I bought my Boat from Art Reiders who owned the old Havencraft. He has since passed away.

When it came time to spec the motor, I told him I would spend the bucks for a four stroke but wasnt decided on EFi vs carb - the usual debate on technology vs ease of fixing in the field....

He looked at me with that experienced look - and used that voice of experience that you learn to recognise in business if you are lucky...and said everyone makes a good motor, but you can get a Mercury serviced anywhere and by most anybody.....of course, he asked me where I would sail first...cant help thinking I owe another good experience to Art, wherever he is sailing on a fair tide now..

[waltpm]

I live on the borderwith Canada(Buffalo, NY) and was keeping my boat at a Canadian marina when I decided to replace the 30 hp that came with my boat with a 50 hp. I purcahsed in Canada which was 30% cheaper, knowing I would have a warranty problem if I needed service in the US. However I had 3 Honda's in the past 20 years that had never needed to be serviced by a dealer and so was not concerned. The following year I burned out the electonics in the boat(my fault, switched batteries with motor running). I took it to the dealer who sold it to me and to my surprise, he fixed it over a holiday weekend, stealing parts from another new motor (a lot of extra work for him). total cost was $2500 and he covered it under warranty. He also sells Suzuki and initially pushed that brand., but for my experience, I will always buy a Honda.

[Frank C]

I'd be happy with a Yugo if that dealer was selling it!




Seems like Paul show spend a weekend and tow his boat to Buffalo, plus a little! How are the tariffs or customs charges to buy that motor and bring it into USA?

[Carl Noble]

When I was contemplating buying a new X at the boat show in 2001 the Mac dealer suggested that if I wanted a Honda motor I should go to Windsor Ontario and have it installed. The savings (including a 37 percent exchange rate at the time) would have been over $2400 . Had I bought the boat I'm sure I would have done just that. I never thought about the warranty issue but would have been ticked off if I was traveling far from home and had a warranty problem with the motor.

[Catigale]

Somethings fishy in Denmark,Horatio

I sell capital equipment and I can tell you the costs of bringing stuff and CSA certifying stuff into Canadian markets is higher than the US.

Unless this motor is different in some way I dont understand how you can be saving upwards of 20-30% on an item like this through a Canadian import channel.

Moreover, why doesnt Mercury, Yamaha, the rest of the companies have a price advantage....whats going on here? Anyone venture a guess?

In the world of cameras, the grey market is levelled by the fact that all the major camera companies have grey market channels - why isnt that the case here with outboard engines??

Hmmmm.

[Theo]

Hi Guys,

Been keeping an eye on this thread and have a couple observations.

1. I believe, Havencraft did go above and beyond in fixing Paul's engine the first time. From what I have been told, at least regarding Suzukis, impellers are considered routine maintenance items and are not covered by warranty.

2. Still, I think it is rather cheesy of Havencraft to sell a grey narket motor without telling its cutomers. Did any of you get the owners manual and peruse it? I bought a used 26X in 2004, and the dealer, Inmon, or the prevoius owner, provided me with every manual to everything on the boat. This included the manuals to; the engine, autopilot, even the stereo and the Origo stove. Inmon also provided me with the complete manual to the fishfinder/GPS I had him install.

3. Has anyone with a Canadian motor tried to contact Canadian Honda regarding Warranty items. The procedure should be outlined in the owners manual!! In my experience, highly mobile products such as; cameras, camcorders, notebook computers, portable audio/video gear, come with numerous warranty contacts around the world. Still, I live in SoCal and am a two hour drive from Mexico. I am not entirely sure what I would do if either my car or boat engine crapped out down there under warranty. Might have to check my owners manuals. Moot point though, just about everything I own is out of warranty!

Theo

[waltpm]

When I bought my Honda in Canada, the 30 % saving also applied to evinrude and Mercury. Don't know why this difference existed but someone was either making a lot of profit on the motors sold in the US, or loosing a lt on the Canadian sales. Frank, if your boat crosses into Canada w/o a motor, and comes back with a motor, nobody seems to notice the difference.

[Catigale]

Thanks Walt

so there is something about the cost of business in Canada that impacts price after all...interesting.

[Jeff S]

Wow, sorry about your problems with such a simple service Paul.

...Own an illegal motor....

I don't think it is "illegal" although you should have been told about that and the fact that Havencraft would perform the work for you as it did not have a US warranty. If they are close than it sounds like it is better than Honda USA's warranty based on what you said. It doesn't sound like a warranty from Honda would do you much good anyway. Now if someone bought one of those engines from them who lives far away . . . that would be pretty upsetting to find out later.

Frustrating experiences like yours have motivated me to learn how to fix things more over time. These types of service people (if you want to call what you received from Woods service) shoot themselves in the foot over time to make an extra buck immediately. Hopefully they will lose more in future business than they made off you for a quick 2 minute repair.

Jeff S

[Jeff Drumm]

Wow, sorry about your problems with such a simple service Paul.

...Own an illegal motor....

I don't think it is "illegal" although you should have been told about that and the fact that ...

I bought one of those engines, and I live pretty far away from Havencraft. Otho paid a local (to me) Honda service center to take care of my hydraulics problem.